Here is an article that isn’t blocked behind a paywall and that accurately attributes the damage to Russian forces.
Evacuations begin after a major dam in southern Ukraine is heavily damaged https://www.npr.org/2023/06/06/1180345954/kakhovka-dam-southern-ukraine-damaged-russia
Okay, I’ll bite. What, in your personal opinion, is the reason for Russian military do blow up the dam? What is the benefit?
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To slow down Ukraine crossing Dnepr and attacking Crimea.
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General scorched earth strategy
And I could easily flip the question around to OP. Why would Ukraine blow up their own dam, flooding their own territory and potentially crippling their own nuclear power plant? And making a counteroffensive across the Dnipro river that much harder?
It’s not to deprive Crimea of water ahead of the counteroffensive, Crimea’s reservoirs are full right now so they’ve got a year’s worth in the tank. That’s about the only possible benefit I can think of that Ukraine might have got out of this, and even if it were so it would be a trivial benefit compared to the costs. Crimea’s water supply isn’t going to make a difference to the actual fight that’s about to happen there.
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Not the OP but to create chaos and divert resources to aid the area would be my guess. Creating a sense of fear and uncertainty is one kind of tactic in my opinion.
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It’s… it’s a war zone, dude. What do you think happened? The dam just exploded all by itself?
The same reason Russia had to blow up the Nord Stream pipeline: they didn’t have any and they didn’t do it, America blew up the pipeline :^)
https://seymourhersh.substack.com/p/how-america-took-out-the-nord-stream
https://thegrayzone.com/2023/06/05/nord-stream-expedition-official-investigators/
defending an evil regime because somehow putin is communist and deserves to be defended in this?
Putin is not a communist and no serious communist claims otherwise, being against NATO and the US’s proxy war against Russia does not mean that I support Putin and his horrible government.
And fired a missle at Poland
Fired a what at whom?
Poland, NATO say missile strike wasn’t a Russian attack
PRZEWODOW, Poland (AP) — NATO member Poland and the head of the military alliance both said Wednesday that a missile strike in Polish farmland that killed two people appeared to be unintentional and was probably launched by air defenses in neighboring Ukraine.
“Ukraine’s defense was launching their missiles in various directions, and it is highly probable that one of these missiles unfortunately fell on Polish territory,” said Polish President Andrzej Duda. “There is nothing, absolutely nothing, to suggest that it was an intentional attack on Poland.”
Edit: downvoted for correcting misinfo quoting NATO and the Polish government, that’s pretty funny :P
There are only 2 types of people who deny that Russia blew up the pipeline:
- People who have a vested interest in supporting Russia’s imperialism and denying their crimes
- Idiots
The European intelligence made clear that the would-be attackers were not rogue operatives. All those involved reported directly to Gen. Valery Zaluzhny, Ukraine’s highest-ranking military officer, who was put in charge so that the nation’s president, Volodymyr Zelensky, wouldn’t know about the operation, the intelligence report said.
Love to see the immediate certainty that Russia did it based on… UA saying so. Impressive media criticism. I’m sure Iraq’s WMDs will turn up any day now, too.
And also based on it making total sense for Russia to have done it, and no sense at all for anyone else to have done it.
It also “made sense” to most Americans that Iraq had WMDs. Colin Powell even said so, and he was greatly respected despite his participation in covering up the My Lai Massacre.
A bunch of whataboutism that has no relevance to the subject at hand.
Accusations of whataboutism are a thought-terminating cliché that, ironically, usually just help the accuser avoid engaging with a critical argument.
The relevance here is that using “it sounds right to me” to decide whether a media narrative is true will lead a person to make big mistakes. And I am criticizing the general lack of media criticism in this thread.
FYI:
The Bush administration, not US intelligence, claimed there were WMDs in Iraq. US intelligence agencies disputed the Bush administration claims repeatedly under oath. Not defending US intelligence in general, just clarifying the specifics of your example.
Is Russia capable of this? Yes.
Is Ukraine capable of this? Yes.
Could the US or China have done this covertly? Yes.
Which one really did it? We’ll never know, but think about why you believe what you do from a story such as the one linked.
Which one really did it? We’ll never know
Oh, we will, be reassured that we will find out eventually.
Could the US or China have done this covertly? Yes.
So this is what we find on Lemmy? A russian apologist as top post?
First post and this is what I read. mmmkay “The USA or China could have destroyed this dam covertly”, right… The good old russian strategy of making you doubt everything you read. The goal of the russian propaganda is not to lie, the goal is to make you trust nothing, and specially not journalists.
A quick look at your history and you constantly bash the Ukrainian resistance.
Yikes! I dunno about that. I’m just saying that we should think critically about what we hear the media.
“Think critically” you say? So where are your facts? Because thinking critically is all about the facts. You have brushed away all the facts and declared “We will never know”. So where are your facts?
For example the russians had control of the dam, not the ukrainians. It’s just an example. What do you make of it? Come on, show us your “critical thinking”.
The article was behind a paywall so apologies if this is covered:
The dam sluices were Russian controlled but the dam is on the front line. It easily could have been attacked by either side. Both sides will see flooding but moreso the Russian side because it’s flatter. Breaching the dam will empty the canal providing much-needed water to Crimea. The lower water level upstream could threaten the safety of an offline nuclear plant upriver. I can’t tell which side controls the plant, so I’m not sure who that would affect more.
Russia could have easily done this to distract Ukraine ahead of it’s counteroffensive and to make the river harder to cross. Also, Ukraine is likely more concerned about helping Ukrainians than Russia. But Ukraine could have done it for the reasons stated. We’re definitely still in the fog of war and it’s ignorant to assume we know all the details.
The dam sluices were Russian controlled but the dam is on the front line. It easily could have been attacked by either side.
Wrong, you don’t destroy a dam just like that. It takes preparation and a lot of explosives at the right points. This is not a Micahel Bay movies we’re talking about.
Both sides will see flooding but moreso the Russian side because it’s flatter. Breaching the dam will empty the canal providing much-needed water to Crimea. The lower water level upstream could threaten the safety of an offline nuclear plant upriver. I can’t tell which side controls the plant, so I’m not sure who that would affect more.
And Putin doesn’t care about all of that. He has proven it again and again.
I can’t tell which side controls the plant
Russia, They took control of the plant, which is illegal, all nations around the globe know perfectly that no army should take control of a civilian power plant. Every other army is trained to carefully avoid the nuclear power plants. For some reason Russia keeps ignoring the international laws.
But Ukraine could have done it for the reasons stated.
Nonsense, but keep trying
We’re definitely still in the fog of war and it’s ignorant to assume we know all the details.
Textbook Russian propaganda here -> “Nobody knows for sure”… Well, keep telling you that, nobody believes you west of Russia.
The dam was under Russian control and they sabotaged it to slow down the Ukrainian counter offensive. It’s fine, Ukraine knew it was a possibility and they have plans accounting for it.
You’re totally right. God bless you for being civil with red fascists
The lower water level upstream could threaten the safety of an offline nuclear plant upriver.
The plant is in the cold shutdown right now, so while it still need some water as cooling, the amount is way lower than in case of normal work, so even in the worst case of complete dam destruction it will not be affected as it is now.
I can’t tell which side controls the plant, so I’m not sure who that would affect more.
Currently Russia.
Russia could have easily done this to distract Ukraine ahead of it’s counteroffensive and to make the river harder to cross.
Problem is, nobody proven that offensive is even real, not to mention that it was prepared there. Currently the most intensive fights are being waged somewhere else. Also Russia recently hit at least two or three huge UA ammo depots which probably really did hampered any preparations. And the battle of Bakhmut was colossal meat grinder where regardless if we agree on exact numbers, Ukraine lost some of their best soldiers remaining (exactly those who would spearhead the offensive) and Russia lost mercenaries.
Both sides will see flooding but moreso the Russian side because it’s flatter.
Also basically all Russian defensive positions along the river were destroyed, countering the guy above on similar level i could say UA surely hit it because it will make their attack much easier when the flood lessens.
Finally, UA already had plans for exactly that action last year, as they admitted to WaPo:
archive link to this article: https://web.archive.org/web/20230101030959/https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/12/29/ukraine-offensive-kharkiv-kherson-donetsk/
Inside the Ukrainian counteroffensive that shocked Putin and reshaped the war
December 29, 2022 at 1:00 a.m. EST
There are no “facts” in cases like this. That’s exactly my point.
I agree with your sentiment. But I’m usually more suspicious of the invading force trying to annex huge regions of a sovereign country. The US, Russia, China are all imperialist in their own way. Russia is the invading force. And none of this would be happening if Russia was not there.
Russia has started an illegal war and is using illegal means. They will pay for this.
