First hand reports from people who were actually there say that there was no massacre.
In the square itself, maybe, but all eyewitnesses agree that the PLA shot and killed many hundreds of protesters in Beijing during the protests, which had been (until that point) largely peaceful.
So while you at the author of this article might be correct to say that there was no actual massacre in Tiananmen Square itself, there certainly was a massacre going on around it.
That was my analysis as well. It’s really hard to tell where his seething hatred for China (and really all of Asia) ends and the truth begins. There’s very little actual substance.
Gold star for you! This is significantly better than the usual nonsense that’s pushed. But after having claimed a massacre for so long, this still seems like damage control to me.
Do these photos look like the aftermath of a massacre to you? Or do you think that the CPC account of the situation might be closer to reality? They claim that after the protest was broken up, some violent instigators began attacking the military in the area around the square. And yes, hundreds died, and many of them were soldiers.
There was a massacre that morning. Journalists have to be precise about where it happened and who were its victims, or readers and viewers will never be able to understand what it meant.
Again, the reporter’s point is not that “there was no massacre”; it just didn’t happen in the square.
Yep. Even after being forced to admit that he made it up, he’s still reporting about things he admits he never saw. Which I have to admit, is a pretty bold move.
I’m really confused by this one. He admitted he lied, and so did many of his colleagues. But you believe that he’s still telling the truth about the massacre?
Look, we don’t know exactly what happened there that night. But it’s clear that the west lied through their teeth about the entire thing, and the lies are self perpetuating at this point. China’s story seems to check out. You HAVE to see that.
Furthermore, why is this event of a couple hundred casualties pushed so hard by the media as proof of China’s evilness, when Mai Lai or the 228 incident are barely talked about? This is 100% pure propaganda, and it’s mostly, perhaps entirely untrue.
It’s hard to know exactly what happened, of course, but the facts of the matter are that even the CCP themselves acknowledged the fact that hundreds died and all the Western journalists who were there confirmed that the PLA shot and killed hundreds of protestors.
Also, while it’s true that Western journalists may have been biased, it’s also certainly true that China’s authoritarian and notoriously opaque government cannot be trusted to tell the truth either, especially if they were responsible for the deaths of many civilians.
While the extent of the massacre in Beijing may be contested, it seems incontrovertible that it did occur.
Furthermore, why is this event of a couple hundred casualties pushed so hard by the media as proof of China’s evilness, when Mai Lai or the 228 incident are barely talked about?
Asides from the fact that this is classic whataboutism, you are categorically wrong to suggest that the My Lai massacre is portrayed in Western media today as anything other than a horrific attack upon civilians.
It is perfectly possible to deplore both massacres, in Beijing and in Mai Lai. This is not a simple zero sum contest between China and the US where one must be the good guy and the other the bad guy.
In the square itself, maybe, but all eyewitnesses agree that the PLA shot and killed many hundreds of protesters in Beijing during the protests, which had been (until that point) largely peaceful.
So while you at the author of this article might be correct to say that there was no actual massacre in Tiananmen Square itself, there certainly was a massacre going on around it.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8057762.stm
https://earnshaw.com/writings/memoirs/tiananmen-story
https://apnews.com/article/4d3bc613370f4f1d97bf841d1ef5ef6c
correct me if I’m wrong, but skimming through this drivel, I’m left with the impression that the author never actually saw anyone get shot
That was my analysis as well. It’s really hard to tell where his seething hatred for China (and really all of Asia) ends and the truth begins. There’s very little actual substance.
it’s filled with gems like “Emperor Deng”
This line cracked me up:
holy shit that is so selfawarewolves territory
what the fuck lmfao
Reputable journalism indeed
Gold star for you! This is significantly better than the usual nonsense that’s pushed. But after having claimed a massacre for so long, this still seems like damage control to me.
Do these photos look like the aftermath of a massacre to you? Or do you think that the CPC account of the situation might be closer to reality? They claim that after the protest was broken up, some violent instigators began attacking the military in the area around the square. And yes, hundreds died, and many of them were soldiers.
Yes, they do. The term “massacre” doesn’t necessarily imply that the protestors didn’t fight back after the PLA started killing them.
I might suggest you read this then. It’s by a reporter for the Washington Post, who was in the city reporting on it at the time.
Again, the reporter’s point is not that “there was no massacre”; it just didn’t happen in the square.
Yep. Even after being forced to admit that he made it up, he’s still reporting about things he admits he never saw. Which I have to admit, is a pretty bold move.
So you initially linked it as a source and now you’ve realized what it actually says, it’s unreliable and worthless?
Seems par for the course around here, tbh.
I’m really confused by this one. He admitted he lied, and so did many of his colleagues. But you believe that he’s still telling the truth about the massacre?
Look, we don’t know exactly what happened there that night. But it’s clear that the west lied through their teeth about the entire thing, and the lies are self perpetuating at this point. China’s story seems to check out. You HAVE to see that.
Furthermore, why is this event of a couple hundred casualties pushed so hard by the media as proof of China’s evilness, when Mai Lai or the 228 incident are barely talked about? This is 100% pure propaganda, and it’s mostly, perhaps entirely untrue.
It’s hard to know exactly what happened, of course, but the facts of the matter are that even the CCP themselves acknowledged the fact that hundreds died and all the Western journalists who were there confirmed that the PLA shot and killed hundreds of protestors.
Also, while it’s true that Western journalists may have been biased, it’s also certainly true that China’s authoritarian and notoriously opaque government cannot be trusted to tell the truth either, especially if they were responsible for the deaths of many civilians.
While the extent of the massacre in Beijing may be contested, it seems incontrovertible that it did occur.
Asides from the fact that this is classic whataboutism, you are categorically wrong to suggest that the My Lai massacre is portrayed in Western media today as anything other than a horrific attack upon civilians.
It is perfectly possible to deplore both massacres, in Beijing and in Mai Lai. This is not a simple zero sum contest between China and the US where one must be the good guy and the other the bad guy.
Also, for reference, here are photos from a massacre that actually did happen.
Never noticed that the upper estimate is almost twice the body count of the June 4th incident.
And the only military casualty was friendly fire.