My point is not that CPC is not a communist party. Ma point is that KPRF isn’t one. So KPRF’s opinion about other party does not matter much in context of this conversation.
I came from Russia, St. Petersburg, and Putin does support KPRF, he congratulates them on every occasion, he brags how Zyuganov is second man in Russian politics, he basically blocks registration of any other communist party in Russia (like RKRP, for example). The union between KPRF and Russian authorities, it started long before split between Russia and West and continued through 90s and 2000s up to this point. KPRF basically exists because of Russian authorities that gifted then some of confiscated money of CPSU back in 1993. At that time there were already different communist parties in Russia, but Eltsin funded creation of this one. The same people who were in charge of Eltsin campaign, were alsa in charge of KPRF’s campaign back then. This party basically betrayed it’s voters every time it could, like in 1996.
I know history quite well. Especially history of Russia. For example, there were social-democrates who decided to unite with bourgeois, the2y called themselfs “mensheviks” and they failed miserably. But there were others, who choose revolution, called themselves “Bolsheviks” and later renamed themself to “communists”. Those established the first socialist state on earth and managed to spread left ideas to half of the world.
The problem with KPRF is not that they support anti-imperialist actions of Putin, many other left parties in Russia do the same. The problem is that they are not supporting anti-capitalist movement inside Russia and even more, they are even interfering with over people trying to do that.
And about young communists in Russia, I do not know there do you come from with this opinion. There are some organization, mostly Trotskyism-oriented who think that because Putin is bad, everything that he does is also bad. But those are not the only ones, and even more, they arr considered outcasts and foolish by the majority. Although they are quite “loud”.
KPRF was created by the bourgeoisie is a old lie perpetuated by the right wingers and libs. I constantly see it on Quora by Russian libs such as Dima Vorobiev, they repeat the old lib jab of CPC having capitalists in China.
Your point is… Basically I simp for CPC for some reason but when Russia commies do the same you hate them. No commie party is without faults and errors. Human history is full of mistakes. Will you call Jiang Zemin era where CPC introduced capitalists right into the party as “communism” Or fight against capitalism. It is not. Russian commies are learning and they are evolving, to discard them as tools of Putin is a EU imperialist talking point. Sorry not interested. Regarding Putin congratulating Zygunanov. Lol… Have you ever been to India? Kerala communists always get greetings from centrists and semi right wingers. Lol.
You guys always talk for revolution and such. It will not happen in Russia until US and EU imperialists are defeated. To quote 1917 decisions where imperialism was weak doesn’t make any sense in 2023. Right now imperialism has evolved into Hyper-imperialism , read the document by Vijay Prashad.
KPRF being created by the bourgeois is shared opinion among everyone in Russia but KPRF itself. Open website of any Russian left movement and see what they think about KPRF. Because it is a fact it can be used by anyone including right-wingers, yes. Right-wingers can even say that the earth is round, but it does not mean that it is in fact flat.
Why do you think I simp for CPC? I just do not want to discuss here if it is communist party or not since it is a complicated matter. But for the record I do not like current policy of CPC. But CPC does not repress left movement in Russia, KPRF does. Russian communists learn from past fails, yes. Only, communists are not in control of KPRF. There are some communists in that party, but on regional level. There ate many comunists in other parties in Russia as well. Only those parties are not allowed to be registered and participate in elections. As for Putin attitude with KPRF it would be fine if not for his attitude to all other communist parties in Russia.
Complete victory against imperialism without revolution would only create the next big imperialist. I do not say that we should right now shtorm kremlin, but supporting his internal politics is not something a communist would do.
Complete victory against imperialism without revolution would only create the next big imperialist
Pure nonsense, I won’t go again with WW1 version of inter imperialist fight to understand multipolarity.
Revolution won’t happen in Russia because Russia is in active fight against hybrid imperialism . You live in utopian world where you judge Russia by 1917 standards, world has changed a lot.
We have communists who whole heartedly support Ukraine and Azov nazis. You don’t have to tell me what those other “left” Guys think of KPRF because those guys say what ever doesn’t make them valid. Take for example, our hardcore naxal based party politburo member started ranting about Stalin and Ukrainian holodomor in 2022 and then about how Putin is a fascist while CPIM stayed with neutrality and correctly condemned NATO for staging the crisis. That naxal politburo member always had to go to left page and was invited by yankee “communist” DemocracyNow where she spoke about how Putin is authoritarian and India is helping Russian fascists. Well Americans would love these “marxists” And leftists who always had a hard on anti marxist marxist. When CPC was in 2010s , yankee left started their propaganda how Cultural Revolution was great and so on. That’s how Boris karvorlitsy works. Sorry not attending his idiotic left pages to know about KPRF.
I don’t understand what you are trying to prove here? I know that there are some people who call themselves left and support fascism. I am not referring to them. I say that scepticism about KPRF is shared among almost every political movement on Russia. If some idiots use this argument it does not make it any less valid. I also do not know what “karvolitsy” is. If you are referring to Kagarlitsky, then I am not referring to him. He is a known clown and he does not have any connection to Russian communists. I am talking about different left organizations in Russia, like RKRP, Rot front, VKPB, skp-kpss etc.
I am only trying to prove that being the so called “commies” who criticized KPRF doesn’t mean they are always telling the right perspective of things , when we you have multiple commie parties just like in India , Nepal they tend to bicker about each and everything for power grab and pseudo ideological fight. These organizations are nothing more than petty clubs w.r.t KPRF. Whether its boris or etc , they tend to amplify certain errors in the past or present to justify their ambitious projects which may not be good for Russia as a whole in long term. So , when people say Boris got arrested for no reason and he is a commie or inversely Zygunavo is a Putin’s stooge , I don’t agree with such evaluation . It reeks of EU lib propaganda and demonization of Russia to a mere one man dictatorship which is not at all possible.
In your language , most people agree KPRF is not communist ? And ? Most people in the world don’t believe CPC is a communist too ? is that a logical explanation ? There are commies like in KKE who claims about chinese imperialism , Russian imperialism and then calling Donbass resistance against Nazis as made up nonsense.
Well, if you do not agree - that is your choice. Everyone in Russia agrees on that and that is more credible source from my perspective. When it is everyone vs one, one is wrong. News articles from past and present, encyclopedias, vitnesses all share the same opinion on the matter.
Your beliefs are your beliefs. There is not much that can be done about them. I, as a Russian and SVO supporter have another opinion. But I think that those communist, who live in Russia and vitnessed KPRF’s work are more trusted source, than tbise, who live outside and are just inversing everything that the west has ever said.
Boris was arrested because he was an idiot, who had poor judjement in what someone should and should not say.
Again, “everyone in Russia agrees with you”. That is hyper nonsensical. Everyone in India loves hindutva fascism and has a strong base for it. Everyone loves this or that is very absurd coming from a so called marxist. I agree hommie commies are more critical of their parties work but… Nevertheless it was KPRF who demanded SMO from 2014 and it was KPRF who had raised the resolution for annexation of Donbass in 2022 . It was Zyganov who always talked about the plight of Donbass and inaction of Russian government in the past.
You are a Russian that doesn’t make you always on the right track. Only the concrete analysis of contradictions makes you a marxist.
It is far less nonsensical than your argument “I heard some lib say something so it must be false”.
It was also almost everyone in Russia, aside from libs, who demanded SVO. By the way, KPRF demanded it so hard, that they (what a coincidence!) decided to put it on the vote in duma only in 2022, right after Putin prepared an army for that. I think even you won’t that it is not something that you can do in one month.
Zyuganov can talk whatever he wanted, but his speeches are not supported by his actions. Zhirinovsky also talked about donbas, does it make LDPR a communist party? If we use this argument the best one would be Limonov and naz-bol party, who sent troops to fight for Donbas in 2014.
As for Marxism, your analysis based on arguments “I heard some lib say it”, “The KPRF has K in it’s name”, “Zyuganov supports Putin, so he must be communist” is far better. Marxist analysis should be based on reality. If your analysis is based on “I don’t want to hear anything, I don’t want to check anything, I once heard some lib, made my opinion and gonna stick with it” then your Marxism is non-existing.
By the way, your argument about Zyuganov supporting SVO is especially funny. Do you know who else support SVO? Russian nazi, like DShRG “Rusich”, like Russian Imperial Corpus etc. What a bunch of communists!
My point is not that CPC is not a communist party. Ma point is that KPRF isn’t one. So KPRF’s opinion about other party does not matter much in context of this conversation.
I came from Russia, St. Petersburg, and Putin does support KPRF, he congratulates them on every occasion, he brags how Zyuganov is second man in Russian politics, he basically blocks registration of any other communist party in Russia (like RKRP, for example). The union between KPRF and Russian authorities, it started long before split between Russia and West and continued through 90s and 2000s up to this point. KPRF basically exists because of Russian authorities that gifted then some of confiscated money of CPSU back in 1993. At that time there were already different communist parties in Russia, but Eltsin funded creation of this one. The same people who were in charge of Eltsin campaign, were alsa in charge of KPRF’s campaign back then. This party basically betrayed it’s voters every time it could, like in 1996.
I know history quite well. Especially history of Russia. For example, there were social-democrates who decided to unite with bourgeois, the2y called themselfs “mensheviks” and they failed miserably. But there were others, who choose revolution, called themselves “Bolsheviks” and later renamed themself to “communists”. Those established the first socialist state on earth and managed to spread left ideas to half of the world.
The problem with KPRF is not that they support anti-imperialist actions of Putin, many other left parties in Russia do the same. The problem is that they are not supporting anti-capitalist movement inside Russia and even more, they are even interfering with over people trying to do that.
And about young communists in Russia, I do not know there do you come from with this opinion. There are some organization, mostly Trotskyism-oriented who think that because Putin is bad, everything that he does is also bad. But those are not the only ones, and even more, they arr considered outcasts and foolish by the majority. Although they are quite “loud”.
KPRF was created by the bourgeoisie is a old lie perpetuated by the right wingers and libs. I constantly see it on Quora by Russian libs such as Dima Vorobiev, they repeat the old lib jab of CPC having capitalists in China.
Your point is… Basically I simp for CPC for some reason but when Russia commies do the same you hate them. No commie party is without faults and errors. Human history is full of mistakes. Will you call Jiang Zemin era where CPC introduced capitalists right into the party as “communism” Or fight against capitalism. It is not. Russian commies are learning and they are evolving, to discard them as tools of Putin is a EU imperialist talking point. Sorry not interested. Regarding Putin congratulating Zygunanov. Lol… Have you ever been to India? Kerala communists always get greetings from centrists and semi right wingers. Lol.
You guys always talk for revolution and such. It will not happen in Russia until US and EU imperialists are defeated. To quote 1917 decisions where imperialism was weak doesn’t make any sense in 2023. Right now imperialism has evolved into Hyper-imperialism , read the document by Vijay Prashad.
KPRF being created by the bourgeois is shared opinion among everyone in Russia but KPRF itself. Open website of any Russian left movement and see what they think about KPRF. Because it is a fact it can be used by anyone including right-wingers, yes. Right-wingers can even say that the earth is round, but it does not mean that it is in fact flat.
Why do you think I simp for CPC? I just do not want to discuss here if it is communist party or not since it is a complicated matter. But for the record I do not like current policy of CPC. But CPC does not repress left movement in Russia, KPRF does. Russian communists learn from past fails, yes. Only, communists are not in control of KPRF. There are some communists in that party, but on regional level. There ate many comunists in other parties in Russia as well. Only those parties are not allowed to be registered and participate in elections. As for Putin attitude with KPRF it would be fine if not for his attitude to all other communist parties in Russia.
Complete victory against imperialism without revolution would only create the next big imperialist. I do not say that we should right now shtorm kremlin, but supporting his internal politics is not something a communist would do.
Complete victory against imperialism without revolution would only create the next big imperialist
Pure nonsense, I won’t go again with WW1 version of inter imperialist fight to understand multipolarity.
Revolution won’t happen in Russia because Russia is in active fight against hybrid imperialism . You live in utopian world where you judge Russia by 1917 standards, world has changed a lot.
We have communists who whole heartedly support Ukraine and Azov nazis. You don’t have to tell me what those other “left” Guys think of KPRF because those guys say what ever doesn’t make them valid. Take for example, our hardcore naxal based party politburo member started ranting about Stalin and Ukrainian holodomor in 2022 and then about how Putin is a fascist while CPIM stayed with neutrality and correctly condemned NATO for staging the crisis. That naxal politburo member always had to go to left page and was invited by yankee “communist” DemocracyNow where she spoke about how Putin is authoritarian and India is helping Russian fascists. Well Americans would love these “marxists” And leftists who always had a hard on anti marxist marxist. When CPC was in 2010s , yankee left started their propaganda how Cultural Revolution was great and so on. That’s how Boris karvorlitsy works. Sorry not attending his idiotic left pages to know about KPRF.
I don’t understand what you are trying to prove here? I know that there are some people who call themselves left and support fascism. I am not referring to them. I say that scepticism about KPRF is shared among almost every political movement on Russia. If some idiots use this argument it does not make it any less valid. I also do not know what “karvolitsy” is. If you are referring to Kagarlitsky, then I am not referring to him. He is a known clown and he does not have any connection to Russian communists. I am talking about different left organizations in Russia, like RKRP, Rot front, VKPB, skp-kpss etc.
I am only trying to prove that being the so called “commies” who criticized KPRF doesn’t mean they are always telling the right perspective of things , when we you have multiple commie parties just like in India , Nepal they tend to bicker about each and everything for power grab and pseudo ideological fight. These organizations are nothing more than petty clubs w.r.t KPRF. Whether its boris or etc , they tend to amplify certain errors in the past or present to justify their ambitious projects which may not be good for Russia as a whole in long term. So , when people say Boris got arrested for no reason and he is a commie or inversely Zygunavo is a Putin’s stooge , I don’t agree with such evaluation . It reeks of EU lib propaganda and demonization of Russia to a mere one man dictatorship which is not at all possible.
In your language , most people agree KPRF is not communist ? And ? Most people in the world don’t believe CPC is a communist too ? is that a logical explanation ? There are commies like in KKE who claims about chinese imperialism , Russian imperialism and then calling Donbass resistance against Nazis as made up nonsense.
Well, if you do not agree - that is your choice. Everyone in Russia agrees on that and that is more credible source from my perspective. When it is everyone vs one, one is wrong. News articles from past and present, encyclopedias, vitnesses all share the same opinion on the matter. Your beliefs are your beliefs. There is not much that can be done about them. I, as a Russian and SVO supporter have another opinion. But I think that those communist, who live in Russia and vitnessed KPRF’s work are more trusted source, than tbise, who live outside and are just inversing everything that the west has ever said.
Boris was arrested because he was an idiot, who had poor judjement in what someone should and should not say.
Again, “everyone in Russia agrees with you”. That is hyper nonsensical. Everyone in India loves hindutva fascism and has a strong base for it. Everyone loves this or that is very absurd coming from a so called marxist. I agree hommie commies are more critical of their parties work but… Nevertheless it was KPRF who demanded SMO from 2014 and it was KPRF who had raised the resolution for annexation of Donbass in 2022 . It was Zyganov who always talked about the plight of Donbass and inaction of Russian government in the past.
You are a Russian that doesn’t make you always on the right track. Only the concrete analysis of contradictions makes you a marxist.
It is far less nonsensical than your argument “I heard some lib say something so it must be false”. It was also almost everyone in Russia, aside from libs, who demanded SVO. By the way, KPRF demanded it so hard, that they (what a coincidence!) decided to put it on the vote in duma only in 2022, right after Putin prepared an army for that. I think even you won’t that it is not something that you can do in one month. Zyuganov can talk whatever he wanted, but his speeches are not supported by his actions. Zhirinovsky also talked about donbas, does it make LDPR a communist party? If we use this argument the best one would be Limonov and naz-bol party, who sent troops to fight for Donbas in 2014.
As for Marxism, your analysis based on arguments “I heard some lib say it”, “The KPRF has K in it’s name”, “Zyuganov supports Putin, so he must be communist” is far better. Marxist analysis should be based on reality. If your analysis is based on “I don’t want to hear anything, I don’t want to check anything, I once heard some lib, made my opinion and gonna stick with it” then your Marxism is non-existing.
By the way, your argument about Zyuganov supporting SVO is especially funny. Do you know who else support SVO? Russian nazi, like DShRG “Rusich”, like Russian Imperial Corpus etc. What a bunch of communists!