One pollster sees “flashing red” signs on youth turnout as Gen Z and millennial voters, who are not satisfied with either party, could again play a decisive role in the next election.
Agreed that the bOtH sIdEs argument is utter bullshit.
However, Roe was never actually codified into law because it was a reliable rallying cry for Democratic politicians. Put another way: Democrats never seriously pushed to make Roe an actual law because it was politically beneficial to the party in elections.
Democratic politicians have bleated about protecting abortion rights for decades, but simultaneously completely ignored actually protecting abortion rights with laws.
Democrats never push to do anything that upsets the status quo. They are cowards. And any democrat who does push that agenda, is labeled some sort of extremist socialist nutjob.
The DNC is almost exclusively just neoliberals at this point.
To be clear, they’re better than the GOP, but that’s also like saying Mussolini was better than Hitler because Mussolini didn’t execute as many people.
Exactly. The DNC only cares about the top 10% (their donor base).The RNC only care about the top 1% (their donor base).
Everyone else is basically voting for people who hate them and have zero interest in making this country better for the majority. If you don’t make like 200k+ a year, our political system basically thinks you should fuck off and die because you’re a waste of human flesh.
Channel your outrage in a way other than voting for a party making things worse. I get you want progress but the options are very very slow progress or regression…don’t vote for regression.
there is no productive way to channel it politically. everyone who is in office and running for office is 100% about maintaining the status quo because it benefits the top 10% to the detriment of everyone else in USA society.
Short of revolution voting is all we have. I understand apathy. I was like that in my 20’s…but I can promise that the right can and will make things worse.
If anything, I’m more apathetic now than when I was in my 20s. I know the right wing will make things worse, but if the left wing doesn’t make things better then we’re still backsliding. Just slower.
the issue is our progress is so slow and our problems are mounting so fast, that it basically seems like we are back sliding… and we are
hence why homelessness, drug use, etc are all rising. if you aren’t in the top 50% of incomes you can’t afford basic shelter or medical care, and you need to be in the top 20% to afford quality shelter and medical care.
There have never been 60 Senate votes to enshrine abortion. The last time Democrats had 60 Senate votes at all was for 2 months early in Obama’s first term – and many of those senators were Manchin style conservative Democrats.
If there were 50 votes in favor of ending the filibuster, then we might actually have enough. But we don’t have that either.
If not like voters were unaware of this either. The pro lifers made abortion a constant topic of discussion. If the electorate wanted Roe enshrined, they would’ve voted for more Democrats, and Democrats who won primaries would be pro choice.
The unfortunate reality is there’s never been enough votes to do so.
I completely agree that both parties aren’t the same, but the data shows that people don’t believe elections are a way to effectively create change. If people don’t think voting will help, they’re less likely to vote. It’s not that people like Republicans more than Democrats, it’s that they don’t like government.
I know several people like this. It’s so hard to explain to them that a vote for the status quo is better than letting things get even worse. If we don’t halt the degeneration we can’t ever turn things around. You can’t push something up without first stopping its fall.
I think the hardest part is that the feedback loop for voting is too slow for people to see its effects. It took decades of consistent voting by conservative Christians to get Roe v. Wade repealed. The urgency of the messaging around voting during election season makes it seem - to a politically-uninterested observer - like each election is an end unto itself.
What really matters with voting is doing it consistently. It should feel like doing your taxes, not like an epic struggle for the future of the country. The idea that a single election will produce the kind of systemic change I think most people want to see is just wrong.
Well, decades of semi-consistent voting (wasn’t so consistent in 2006 or 08, just to grab two elections off the top of my head), and a couple billion dollars in dark money thrown at judges and law schools and think tanks to launder all their extremist garbage, which is something the left doesn’t really have
Elected conservatives consistently work towards what they run on. Elected Democrats have this nasty habit of showing extremely public contempt for progressives, and then if they try to do anything at all toward fixing what they just showed contempt for, doing so quietly, all the while demanding fawning praise from progressives.
Progressives see what voting gets them. Republicans didn’t keep the public option from coming to the floor for a vote. Republicans didn’t give a cutesy thumbs down to increasing minimum wage. Republicans didn’t systematically rip BBB apart over the course of months. Progressives see Democrats have the means to improve things and find enough no votes to prevent that improvement, in some cases being gleeful about it. Every time they have a medical expense that their garbage insurance denies, they remember giving Democrats a supermajority and watching them find the votes to kill the public option. Every time they can’t make ends meet, they remember giving Democrats a majority and then watching Sinema’s thumbs down. Every time they spend too much for daycare, or can’t afford to put their child in pre-k, or can’t take medical leave, or afford community college, they remember giving Democrats a majority and watching Democrats dismantle BBB without any help at all from Republicans, extremely publicly over the course of months. And those scars reopen.
Democrats wonder why they don’t get immediate enthusiastic lockstep voting from the electorate. They never expect it from the elected.
It’s not his fault, but it explains why people don’t think voting will help.
That attitude is why Rowe v. Wade is gone now. The Parties are NOT the same!!!
Agreed that the bOtH sIdEs argument is utter bullshit.
However, Roe was never actually codified into law because it was a reliable rallying cry for Democratic politicians. Put another way: Democrats never seriously pushed to make Roe an actual law because it was politically beneficial to the party in elections.
Democratic politicians have bleated about protecting abortion rights for decades, but simultaneously completely ignored actually protecting abortion rights with laws.
Democrats never push to do anything that upsets the status quo. They are cowards. And any democrat who does push that agenda, is labeled some sort of extremist socialist nutjob.
This is why so many of us are outraged.
The DNC is almost exclusively just neoliberals at this point.
To be clear, they’re better than the GOP, but that’s also like saying Mussolini was better than Hitler because Mussolini didn’t execute as many people.
Exactly. The DNC only cares about the top 10% (their donor base).The RNC only care about the top 1% (their donor base).
Everyone else is basically voting for people who hate them and have zero interest in making this country better for the majority. If you don’t make like 200k+ a year, our political system basically thinks you should fuck off and die because you’re a waste of human flesh.
Channel your outrage in a way other than voting for a party making things worse. I get you want progress but the options are very very slow progress or regression…don’t vote for regression.
People are outraged because laws and public opinion have a statistical correlation of 0, unless you sample exclusively from the very top of the socioeconomic strata. That’s a very reasonable thing to be irate about in a country that’s ostensibly a democracy.
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there is no productive way to channel it politically. everyone who is in office and running for office is 100% about maintaining the status quo because it benefits the top 10% to the detriment of everyone else in USA society.
all i can do is fix up my house. lol
Gen Z + Millennials = 142 Million
Gen X + Boomers = 134 Million
The youth of this country has been conned into thinking they have no power. Boomers don’t want you to vote.
If the best we can do is very slow progress it’s no wonder people don’t think voting is effective
Short of revolution voting is all we have. I understand apathy. I was like that in my 20’s…but I can promise that the right can and will make things worse.
If anything, I’m more apathetic now than when I was in my 20s. I know the right wing will make things worse, but if the left wing doesn’t make things better then we’re still backsliding. Just slower.
the issue is our progress is so slow and our problems are mounting so fast, that it basically seems like we are back sliding… and we are
hence why homelessness, drug use, etc are all rising. if you aren’t in the top 50% of incomes you can’t afford basic shelter or medical care, and you need to be in the top 20% to afford quality shelter and medical care.
There have never been 60 Senate votes to enshrine abortion. The last time Democrats had 60 Senate votes at all was for 2 months early in Obama’s first term – and many of those senators were Manchin style conservative Democrats.
If there were 50 votes in favor of ending the filibuster, then we might actually have enough. But we don’t have that either.
If not like voters were unaware of this either. The pro lifers made abortion a constant topic of discussion. If the electorate wanted Roe enshrined, they would’ve voted for more Democrats, and Democrats who won primaries would be pro choice.
The unfortunate reality is there’s never been enough votes to do so.
I completely agree that both parties aren’t the same, but the data shows that people don’t believe elections are a way to effectively create change. If people don’t think voting will help, they’re less likely to vote. It’s not that people like Republicans more than Democrats, it’s that they don’t like government.
Removed by mod
I know several people like this. It’s so hard to explain to them that a vote for the status quo is better than letting things get even worse. If we don’t halt the degeneration we can’t ever turn things around. You can’t push something up without first stopping its fall.
I think the hardest part is that the feedback loop for voting is too slow for people to see its effects. It took decades of consistent voting by conservative Christians to get Roe v. Wade repealed. The urgency of the messaging around voting during election season makes it seem - to a politically-uninterested observer - like each election is an end unto itself.
What really matters with voting is doing it consistently. It should feel like doing your taxes, not like an epic struggle for the future of the country. The idea that a single election will produce the kind of systemic change I think most people want to see is just wrong.
Well, decades of semi-consistent voting (wasn’t so consistent in 2006 or 08, just to grab two elections off the top of my head), and a couple billion dollars in dark money thrown at judges and law schools and think tanks to launder all their extremist garbage, which is something the left doesn’t really have
conservatives are more far-sighted than the democracts, yes. that is why they have been so much more successful.
they are also far more willing to lie, cheat, and steal. The democrats won’t.
Elected conservatives consistently work towards what they run on. Elected Democrats have this nasty habit of showing extremely public contempt for progressives, and then if they try to do anything at all toward fixing what they just showed contempt for, doing so quietly, all the while demanding fawning praise from progressives.
Progressives see what voting gets them. Republicans didn’t keep the public option from coming to the floor for a vote. Republicans didn’t give a cutesy thumbs down to increasing minimum wage. Republicans didn’t systematically rip BBB apart over the course of months. Progressives see Democrats have the means to improve things and find enough no votes to prevent that improvement, in some cases being gleeful about it. Every time they have a medical expense that their garbage insurance denies, they remember giving Democrats a supermajority and watching them find the votes to kill the public option. Every time they can’t make ends meet, they remember giving Democrats a majority and then watching Sinema’s thumbs down. Every time they spend too much for daycare, or can’t afford to put their child in pre-k, or can’t take medical leave, or afford community college, they remember giving Democrats a majority and watching Democrats dismantle BBB without any help at all from Republicans, extremely publicly over the course of months. And those scars reopen.
Democrats wonder why they don’t get immediate enthusiastic lockstep voting from the electorate. They never expect it from the elected.