True on several counts. I don’t believe it’s a genetic predisposition for evil, so much as an inability in many prosocial areas. But this does not automatically mean their behavior is criminal, it’s often more low level emotional abuse of others - and there are many who grow into more prosocial behaviors.
At any rate, people with autism who do not have empathy have additional bio-psychologi al factors that may straight up be comorbid NPD - depending of course how much it “disorders” ones life (diagnoses are always contextual to ones environment and conditions). But there’s also learned narcissistic tendencies as a maladaptive way of coping with extreme conditions.
Getting to the core point though, ND is only ever a problem if it manifests as harmful behavior. Someone with the prerequisite genetics of someone with Antisocial Personality Disorder (colloquially called psychopath or sociopath), is not guaranteed to be a murderer for instance, but if they grow up in extreme trauma or abuse it becomes a lot more likely. All that to say, these are neurodivergences and fine on their own - but narcissistic or psychotic behavior that hurts people is a problem.
It gets problematic if we overdiagnose and pathologize everyone as well as if we excuse harmful behavior because of someone’s ND. So like you said, it goes back to taking more time to work with someone, but most of society isn’t going to do that in these conditions, which will further alienate such individuals and increase the harmful behaviors.
i’m not sure we are actually agreeing here. yes, if someone is being abusive then addressing the abuse takes priority; the issue is the assumption that being diagnosed means one is an abuser, per se. and even in the case of low level abuse of others, that doesn’t disqualify someone from being ND. lots of ND and mentally ill people do bad things, often as children, which then gets them diagnosed and subjected to the abuses of mental health institutions.
being ND isn’t a label you only get if you’re on good behavior, it’s something you are, it is a relation to the norms enforced by a medicalized society. i am autistic not because i do nice things and deserve a pass on my stuttering and odd facial expressions and mannerisms, i am autistic because a nazi collaborator wanted a metric to decide which children should be kept alive and which ones should be euthanized. ND includes anyone whose brains are deemed aberrant. i am treated and accommodated (or not accommodated) a certain way, regardless of knowledge of any formal diagnosis, and so I’m autistic because of that rather than a diagnosis.
i really don’t like the “people are being overdiagnosed to excuse shitty behavior” line for this reason. yes, people do look for excuses when they do bad things, but that does not mean people are lying about whatever ND identity.
![[CW: chaser username] Hexbear: Not pro-LGBTQ+, the Israel of Lemmy instances](https://hexbear.net/pictrs/image/ecb0ac2c-5607-439f-8507-ec2eb8170ba5.png){kind=link}
True on several counts. I don’t believe it’s a genetic predisposition for evil, so much as an inability in many prosocial areas. But this does not automatically mean their behavior is criminal, it’s often more low level emotional abuse of others - and there are many who grow into more prosocial behaviors.
At any rate, people with autism who do not have empathy have additional bio-psychologi al factors that may straight up be comorbid NPD - depending of course how much it “disorders” ones life (diagnoses are always contextual to ones environment and conditions). But there’s also learned narcissistic tendencies as a maladaptive way of coping with extreme conditions.
Getting to the core point though, ND is only ever a problem if it manifests as harmful behavior. Someone with the prerequisite genetics of someone with Antisocial Personality Disorder (colloquially called psychopath or sociopath), is not guaranteed to be a murderer for instance, but if they grow up in extreme trauma or abuse it becomes a lot more likely. All that to say, these are neurodivergences and fine on their own - but narcissistic or psychotic behavior that hurts people is a problem.
It gets problematic if we overdiagnose and pathologize everyone as well as if we excuse harmful behavior because of someone’s ND. So like you said, it goes back to taking more time to work with someone, but most of society isn’t going to do that in these conditions, which will further alienate such individuals and increase the harmful behaviors.
Shits hard yo.
i’m not sure we are actually agreeing here. yes, if someone is being abusive then addressing the abuse takes priority; the issue is the assumption that being diagnosed means one is an abuser, per se. and even in the case of low level abuse of others, that doesn’t disqualify someone from being ND. lots of ND and mentally ill people do bad things, often as children, which then gets them diagnosed and subjected to the abuses of mental health institutions.
being ND isn’t a label you only get if you’re on good behavior, it’s something you are, it is a relation to the norms enforced by a medicalized society. i am autistic not because i do nice things and deserve a pass on my stuttering and odd facial expressions and mannerisms, i am autistic because a nazi collaborator wanted a metric to decide which children should be kept alive and which ones should be euthanized. ND includes anyone whose brains are deemed aberrant. i am treated and accommodated (or not accommodated) a certain way, regardless of knowledge of any formal diagnosis, and so I’m autistic because of that rather than a diagnosis.
i really don’t like the “people are being overdiagnosed to excuse shitty behavior” line for this reason. yes, people do look for excuses when they do bad things, but that does not mean people are lying about whatever ND identity.