Before the invention of the police, communities took it upon themselves to enforce the law. Oftentimes, militia members would directly write to governors asking for arms, and would also be present in their communities during public events where an armed presence might be necessary. Arrests for members of the community would happen by way of court order first, and then a posse would be formed as a means to enact that court order. Nowhere in the US constitution does the word “police” appear because the idea hadn’t even been conceived at the time of foundation.
Comparatively, today’s police have far more authority to enact violence and effect arrests than even the courts. Could a court today order a dog to maul a surrendering man? Probably not. But when the police do it, apparently, that’s just the cost of doing business.
I think the lie is that we need the police and not the other way around.
We need a complete overhaul of society and an educated population to help reduce the incentive to commit crime in the first place, then use the wonders of the high technology we have to make investigating crimes easier for everybody so we can go back to taking control of our own streets again.
It’d take a lot of work to do it, but it’s better than submitting to actual fucking fascism and tyranny because we convince ourselves we’re not capable and need others to do the job of protecting each other for us.
Dude, their existence prevents the meaningful enforcement of the law. Literally anyone else could do a better job than some thug caste which only pretends to enforce law but doesn’t.
You haven’t answered the question. Who should enforce the law? I’m not sure if you have a problem with the concept of police or with the implementation thereof.
You’d think if they actually were asking in good faith, they’d scroll down to talk to the guy who actually does answer the question at length, but they don’t, so it’s obvious they’re not actually interested.
Bro, I’m asking you for your thoughts on an alternative and you just rage on about some perceived slight to your intelligence or what not.
If you don’t have an alternative, then say so. Stop beating around the bush pretending to hoard some plan you do not possess. It wasn’t a difficult fucking question you nutjob.
Let’s take the thought a step further and ask; who’s existence wouldn’t prevent the meaningful enforcement of the law?
IMO police, or something to that nature, are pretty necessary in today’s society, but the boundaries they have, are stepped over time and time again, without the proper repercussions.
For those watching at home, what this bootlicker is doing is sealioning. It involves asking questions for which the answers will never be satisfactory while pretending to be nice and civil.
His line of reasoning is this:
These stupid fucking liberals have no plan for what to do after the police are removed
So let’s ask them what do we do afterward?
Then we either deconstruct every answer they provide or call them out on having no answer
Then disingenuously dismiss the idea of getting rid of police as ill thought out and immature when we never had any intention of conceding the point to begin with, because we want police to continue subjugating and abusing people, because we are bigots
Because their justification for having police is:
The people are not capable or mature enough to conduct criminal investigations, arrest suspects or humanely punish them (even though that’s literally what humanity has been doing for thousands of years and the institution of police has proven itself wholly incapable of those tasks and even worse, directly causing and enabling the crime it’s supposedly there to mitigate, and the prison system the police run is completely fucking inhumane)
Therefore the people need an institution of professionals to do it for them (even though police are not trained to conduct formal investigations, forensic science is not a legitimate science at all and is completely broken at best, and humanity has again managed to exist thousands of years in peace and happiness without thug castes and only suffer when they are there)
And ignoring the fact that bootlickers like him are deeply insulting the intelligence of everyone else in the discussion and this clown is clearly NOT being nice at all because he’s advocating for your brutal subjugation under the jackboot of sadistic racists that only want to bully, abuse, rape and murder you, other individuals have already answered the question effectively, so why am I going to entertain scum like him?
So here’s what I am gonna say to him instead:
How about instead of wasting our time sealioning to push a line of reasoning designed to manipulate our fears and put down our self esteem and self worth in order to convince us to accept an obviously failed institution that causes nothing but harm and abuses us in horrific ways, you take your fake attitude and go fuck yourself with it?
You said your piece, and it turns out you’re completely wrong in your assumptions, and instead of addressing that fact, and re-engageing me, you’ve ignored what I replied with. You stroked your ego initially by not engaging with me and addressing every one else in the thread, in a very shallow way I might add, but I do wonder how your ego is doing now? This is a potential learning point for you, but only you can decide to become better than the person you were a few days ago. I do hope.
Maybe you’ve just learnt the term sealioning, and it’s your word of the week.
You might carry on lambasting people based on your misguided interpretations, but I have hope you’ll one day think critically about this interaction, and move forward with a new understanding.
I’ll go out on a limb and assume you’re American, young, and just immature and naive enough to think you have all the answers, which from my experience leaves you an “all or nothing” attitude, and so everything is a fight for you.
Unable to see nuance in conversation, especially over the Internet where context is very easily mistaken, I’ll give you some friendly, human to human advice; sometimes people just want to learn, and not everything is a fight you have to take.
Based on the aggressive tone of your comment, seeing a legitimate question as a perceived slight at best, you might already be set in your ways.
To put it bluntly, you saw that you should gatekeep a learning moment for someone else, probably more or less on your side, trying to understand the nuance of the conversation.
I read something on here that makes a lot of sense to me, and so I’ll repeat it here. The America DEI mentality is anything but inclusive, and is very confrontational to the point of working against what it’s supposed to defend.
I recommend you read Aldous Huxleys:The island, and try to understand that compassion, not baseless vitriol, is the way we progress as a species.
If you take anything away from this, coming from someone far further along the left leaning path you’re quite clearly on, to me you’re just as bad as the people you vilify, such as the police in America.
Your reaction without due cause is just as bad as theirs, thankfully you haven’t nearly the power or influence they have, and if you are truly are as liberal as you think you are, I believe you’re at least on the right path, even if your delivery and methods are synonymous with the right.
I wish you the best for the future.
Yours sincerely, the biggest advocate for a true functional utopia you’ll ever have the pleasure of interacting with, online or in person.
These stupid fucking liberals have no plan for what to do after the police are removed
I have no idea what the outcome would be, I’m pretty new to this line of thinking so I thought if I ask someone I might get an answer I can move forward with. But what is the plan? Again, genuinely asking because I want to learn.
So let’s ask them what do we do afterward?
Well yeah, what else do I do if I want to engage and learn?
Then we either deconstruct every answer they provide or call them out on having no answer
I promise you, I couldn’t begin to deconstruct any answer, because this is literally the first time I’ve engaged in this line of thinking. I’m from the UK, haven’t had the best experience with police myself, and due to some inherent distrust of self proclaimed authority without boundaries, it’s in my interest to be aware of the options for the future.
Then disingenuously dismiss the idea of getting rid of police as ill thought out and immature when we never had any intention of conceding the point to begin with, because we want police to continue subjugating and abusing people, because we are bigots
I’ve not got a point to concede, it’s completely my opinion, based on my knowledge of current society that we need them for some sort of order.
The only answer I can give you here is I read Aldous Huxley:The island when I was younger, and it shaped the way I think to some degree. As idyllic an idea he portrays, the island Pala, I’ve been living in accordance with the principles he writes about, and leading by example. It’s caused me mental anguish for 2 decades that humanity is moving in the opposite direction, been called a dreamer and utopian thinker by some friends I’ve grown up with, and since distanced myself from them, cultivating friends and connections that can see the potential of humanity.
I’ve identified how much of the world is wrapped up in a selfish attitude towards their own life, and I’ve felt like I’m fighting a losing battle for 20+ years, I’m an absolute wreck because of it, my life is in shambles because I’m let down again and again, day after day, year after year, decade after decade.
Because their justification for having police is:
My justification for having police is based on my life having police in it, nothing more. I’m saying here that I want the world aldous writes about, regarding Pala. I’ve been striving for it, but every sign has shit on my thought that we COULD have that world, and I’m a mental breakdown machine because the reality is a select few have propagated the idea that selfishness is king, and the rest of humanity is on board.
I will say I do believe certain institutions are beneficial, such as education, healthcare, scientific institutions (so that we better understand the universe we find ourselves in). But I’m a complete noob when it comes to talking about this, so I could be missing the mark, I don’t KNOW. Its just my opinion.
And ignoring the fact that bootlickers like him are deeply insulting the intelligence of everyone else in the discussion and this clown is clearly NOT being nice at all because he’s advocating for your brutal subjugation under the jackboot of sadistic racists that only want to bully, abuse, rape and murder you, other individuals have already answered the question effectively, so why am I going to entertain scum like him?
I’m sorry if I insulted yours and everyone else’s intelligence by asking, but even now, I’m not looking for a fight in this.
I was trying to be diplomatic in my question, if not overly open to learning about it, and with my lack of knowledge in this area I’ve clearly engaged in the wrong way.
Whether it be the way I asked, or if I may say, you’ve encountered so many disingenuous people regarding this, which I can believe, you aren’t used to people being genuine.
I really don’t mean to offend in saying that.
I’m vegan (how do you know someone’s vegan? meme on me idc) and I’ve sometimes found myself being reactionary to genuine questions about “plant feel pain” etc, that I’ve initially disregarded people, before they’ve told me they read it somewhere and they don’t really know what to believe, and so are asking for my take.
If you can point me to other individuals that have answered effectively, I’ll read and read and read before I engage again.
You’ve written me off as scum, but I’ve not written you off, because I’m not that guy.
I’m not the guy to read what you put and take offense, or want to push back, or ignore your harsh words, however incorrect, and further an agenda opposing yours.
I’m more than likely that one guy, in a sea of selfish fucks you’ve encountered, that is just trying to learn about how we can get to Pala.
How about instead of wasting our time sealioning to push a line of reasoning designed to manipulate our fears and put down our self esteem and self worth in order to convince us to accept an obviously failed institution that causes nothing but harm and abuses us in horrific ways, you take your fake attitude and go fuck yourself with it?
I’ve not designed anything, it was pure sincerity. I’m not trying to manipulate you.
On that note, I read Richard Dawkins:the selfish gene at 13 years old. My first job at 15 was in retail In a high end department store. I was trained to sell stuff, up-sell everything I could, and make some already rich fuck even more money, while I was grafting my ass off for ~£3.50 an hour (2005)
I came across the concept of social engineering around the same time and realised I had a choice, I can socially engineer people to benefit me, or socially engineer people to benefit themselves. And as a dumb af 16 year old, I related it back to the selfish gene. Selfishness, or altruism. I have a choice, and chose altruism. That’s the only manipulation I do (I’m a human living in this world, so I’m not perfect)
I grew up in a good home, with a mother that I can honestly say, in my hyperbolic opinion, is love incarnate.
She poured so much love into me that when I grew up and started to think for myself, I realised I’m so fucking alone in this fight that I have to be the example and give that love back to whoever I can, and whoever needs it.
I’ve been fucked over and over for giving pieces of myself to bring other people up, just to be abandoned by the same people, that I’m a shell of a human, still trying to get to Pala.
I’m sorry for the essay, I didn’t expect to be writing all this.
You call out my “fake attitude” and said “go fuck yourself with it”. There’s no need, because the world had fucked me for 2 decades now, because of my real attitude.
I hope you respond with an answer to my initial question, or at the very least, check your assumptions.
If you’re reaction to reading all this is “he can’t be serious, no one is like this, he must be talking the biggest amount of bullshit to save face”
I am serious. I am like this. Because if I give up now, I might as well top myself.
Peace.
Edit: I’ll give you a day to reply. If you don’t, I’ll give my opinion on you, because that’s all you have. An opinion. Based on speculation from past experiences in your life, I’m willing to give you the benefit of the doubt, even when that same grace wasn’t offered me. And your opinion is very misguided.
I agree with you. I just take it a step further and state there should be no cops at all.
So who should enforce the law?
I’m just gonna play devil’s advocate here.
Before the invention of the police, communities took it upon themselves to enforce the law. Oftentimes, militia members would directly write to governors asking for arms, and would also be present in their communities during public events where an armed presence might be necessary. Arrests for members of the community would happen by way of court order first, and then a posse would be formed as a means to enact that court order. Nowhere in the US constitution does the word “police” appear because the idea hadn’t even been conceived at the time of foundation.
Comparatively, today’s police have far more authority to enact violence and effect arrests than even the courts. Could a court today order a dog to maul a surrendering man? Probably not. But when the police do it, apparently, that’s just the cost of doing business.
I think the lie is that we need the police and not the other way around.
We need a complete overhaul of society and an educated population to help reduce the incentive to commit crime in the first place, then use the wonders of the high technology we have to make investigating crimes easier for everybody so we can go back to taking control of our own streets again.
It’d take a lot of work to do it, but it’s better than submitting to actual fucking fascism and tyranny because we convince ourselves we’re not capable and need others to do the job of protecting each other for us.
Fuck the laws someone should be out there enforcing our rights.
Dude, their existence prevents the meaningful enforcement of the law. Literally anyone else could do a better job than some thug caste which only pretends to enforce law but doesn’t.
You haven’t answered the question. Who should enforce the law? I’m not sure if you have a problem with the concept of police or with the implementation thereof.
And here’s bootlicker #2 up in here sealioning just like the other guy, and my response is the same.
You’d think if they actually were asking in good faith, they’d scroll down to talk to the guy who actually does answer the question at length, but they don’t, so it’s obvious they’re not actually interested.
Bro, I’m asking you for your thoughts on an alternative and you just rage on about some perceived slight to your intelligence or what not.
If you don’t have an alternative, then say so. Stop beating around the bush pretending to hoard some plan you do not possess. It wasn’t a difficult fucking question you nutjob.
Let’s take the thought a step further and ask; who’s existence wouldn’t prevent the meaningful enforcement of the law?
IMO police, or something to that nature, are pretty necessary in today’s society, but the boundaries they have, are stepped over time and time again, without the proper repercussions.
What’s your take?
For those watching at home, what this bootlicker is doing is sealioning. It involves asking questions for which the answers will never be satisfactory while pretending to be nice and civil.
His line of reasoning is this:
These stupid fucking liberals have no plan for what to do after the police are removed
So let’s ask them what do we do afterward?
Then we either deconstruct every answer they provide or call them out on having no answer
Then disingenuously dismiss the idea of getting rid of police as ill thought out and immature when we never had any intention of conceding the point to begin with, because we want police to continue subjugating and abusing people, because we are bigots
Because their justification for having police is:
The people are not capable or mature enough to conduct criminal investigations, arrest suspects or humanely punish them (even though that’s literally what humanity has been doing for thousands of years and the institution of police has proven itself wholly incapable of those tasks and even worse, directly causing and enabling the crime it’s supposedly there to mitigate, and the prison system the police run is completely fucking inhumane)
Therefore the people need an institution of professionals to do it for them (even though police are not trained to conduct formal investigations, forensic science is not a legitimate science at all and is completely broken at best, and humanity has again managed to exist thousands of years in peace and happiness without thug castes and only suffer when they are there)
And ignoring the fact that bootlickers like him are deeply insulting the intelligence of everyone else in the discussion and this clown is clearly NOT being nice at all because he’s advocating for your brutal subjugation under the jackboot of sadistic racists that only want to bully, abuse, rape and murder you, other individuals have already answered the question effectively, so why am I going to entertain scum like him?
So here’s what I am gonna say to him instead:
How about instead of wasting our time sealioning to push a line of reasoning designed to manipulate our fears and put down our self esteem and self worth in order to convince us to accept an obviously failed institution that causes nothing but harm and abuses us in horrific ways, you take your fake attitude and go fuck yourself with it?
What’s your take on that?
So, here we are.
You said your piece, and it turns out you’re completely wrong in your assumptions, and instead of addressing that fact, and re-engageing me, you’ve ignored what I replied with. You stroked your ego initially by not engaging with me and addressing every one else in the thread, in a very shallow way I might add, but I do wonder how your ego is doing now? This is a potential learning point for you, but only you can decide to become better than the person you were a few days ago. I do hope.
Maybe you’ve just learnt the term sealioning, and it’s your word of the week. You might carry on lambasting people based on your misguided interpretations, but I have hope you’ll one day think critically about this interaction, and move forward with a new understanding.
I’ll go out on a limb and assume you’re American, young, and just immature and naive enough to think you have all the answers, which from my experience leaves you an “all or nothing” attitude, and so everything is a fight for you.
Unable to see nuance in conversation, especially over the Internet where context is very easily mistaken, I’ll give you some friendly, human to human advice; sometimes people just want to learn, and not everything is a fight you have to take.
Based on the aggressive tone of your comment, seeing a legitimate question as a perceived slight at best, you might already be set in your ways.
To put it bluntly, you saw that you should gatekeep a learning moment for someone else, probably more or less on your side, trying to understand the nuance of the conversation.
I read something on here that makes a lot of sense to me, and so I’ll repeat it here. The America DEI mentality is anything but inclusive, and is very confrontational to the point of working against what it’s supposed to defend.
I recommend you read Aldous Huxleys:The island, and try to understand that compassion, not baseless vitriol, is the way we progress as a species.
If you take anything away from this, coming from someone far further along the left leaning path you’re quite clearly on, to me you’re just as bad as the people you vilify, such as the police in America. Your reaction without due cause is just as bad as theirs, thankfully you haven’t nearly the power or influence they have, and if you are truly are as liberal as you think you are, I believe you’re at least on the right path, even if your delivery and methods are synonymous with the right.
I wish you the best for the future.
Yours sincerely, the biggest advocate for a true functional utopia you’ll ever have the pleasure of interacting with, online or in person.
Peace.
Well then, here we go…
I have no idea what the outcome would be, I’m pretty new to this line of thinking so I thought if I ask someone I might get an answer I can move forward with. But what is the plan? Again, genuinely asking because I want to learn.
Well yeah, what else do I do if I want to engage and learn?
I promise you, I couldn’t begin to deconstruct any answer, because this is literally the first time I’ve engaged in this line of thinking. I’m from the UK, haven’t had the best experience with police myself, and due to some inherent distrust of self proclaimed authority without boundaries, it’s in my interest to be aware of the options for the future.
I’ve not got a point to concede, it’s completely my opinion, based on my knowledge of current society that we need them for some sort of order.
The only answer I can give you here is I read Aldous Huxley:The island when I was younger, and it shaped the way I think to some degree. As idyllic an idea he portrays, the island Pala, I’ve been living in accordance with the principles he writes about, and leading by example. It’s caused me mental anguish for 2 decades that humanity is moving in the opposite direction, been called a dreamer and utopian thinker by some friends I’ve grown up with, and since distanced myself from them, cultivating friends and connections that can see the potential of humanity. I’ve identified how much of the world is wrapped up in a selfish attitude towards their own life, and I’ve felt like I’m fighting a losing battle for 20+ years, I’m an absolute wreck because of it, my life is in shambles because I’m let down again and again, day after day, year after year, decade after decade.
My justification for having police is based on my life having police in it, nothing more. I’m saying here that I want the world aldous writes about, regarding Pala. I’ve been striving for it, but every sign has shit on my thought that we COULD have that world, and I’m a mental breakdown machine because the reality is a select few have propagated the idea that selfishness is king, and the rest of humanity is on board. I will say I do believe certain institutions are beneficial, such as education, healthcare, scientific institutions (so that we better understand the universe we find ourselves in). But I’m a complete noob when it comes to talking about this, so I could be missing the mark, I don’t KNOW. Its just my opinion.
I’m sorry if I insulted yours and everyone else’s intelligence by asking, but even now, I’m not looking for a fight in this. I was trying to be diplomatic in my question, if not overly open to learning about it, and with my lack of knowledge in this area I’ve clearly engaged in the wrong way. Whether it be the way I asked, or if I may say, you’ve encountered so many disingenuous people regarding this, which I can believe, you aren’t used to people being genuine. I really don’t mean to offend in saying that. I’m vegan (how do you know someone’s vegan? meme on me idc) and I’ve sometimes found myself being reactionary to genuine questions about “plant feel pain” etc, that I’ve initially disregarded people, before they’ve told me they read it somewhere and they don’t really know what to believe, and so are asking for my take.
If you can point me to other individuals that have answered effectively, I’ll read and read and read before I engage again. You’ve written me off as scum, but I’ve not written you off, because I’m not that guy. I’m not the guy to read what you put and take offense, or want to push back, or ignore your harsh words, however incorrect, and further an agenda opposing yours. I’m more than likely that one guy, in a sea of selfish fucks you’ve encountered, that is just trying to learn about how we can get to Pala.
I’ve not designed anything, it was pure sincerity. I’m not trying to manipulate you. On that note, I read Richard Dawkins:the selfish gene at 13 years old. My first job at 15 was in retail In a high end department store. I was trained to sell stuff, up-sell everything I could, and make some already rich fuck even more money, while I was grafting my ass off for ~£3.50 an hour (2005) I came across the concept of social engineering around the same time and realised I had a choice, I can socially engineer people to benefit me, or socially engineer people to benefit themselves. And as a dumb af 16 year old, I related it back to the selfish gene. Selfishness, or altruism. I have a choice, and chose altruism. That’s the only manipulation I do (I’m a human living in this world, so I’m not perfect)
I grew up in a good home, with a mother that I can honestly say, in my hyperbolic opinion, is love incarnate. She poured so much love into me that when I grew up and started to think for myself, I realised I’m so fucking alone in this fight that I have to be the example and give that love back to whoever I can, and whoever needs it. I’ve been fucked over and over for giving pieces of myself to bring other people up, just to be abandoned by the same people, that I’m a shell of a human, still trying to get to Pala.
I’m sorry for the essay, I didn’t expect to be writing all this. You call out my “fake attitude” and said “go fuck yourself with it”. There’s no need, because the world had fucked me for 2 decades now, because of my real attitude.
I hope you respond with an answer to my initial question, or at the very least, check your assumptions.
If you’re reaction to reading all this is “he can’t be serious, no one is like this, he must be talking the biggest amount of bullshit to save face”
I am serious. I am like this. Because if I give up now, I might as well top myself.
Peace.
Edit: I’ll give you a day to reply. If you don’t, I’ll give my opinion on you, because that’s all you have. An opinion. Based on speculation from past experiences in your life, I’m willing to give you the benefit of the doubt, even when that same grace wasn’t offered me. And your opinion is very misguided.
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If there would be no cops, everybody would just adhere to the laws, duh!
Just like the magical free market for businesses. Just trust them!
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No! Jesus Christ! No! Are you insane!