• Vespair
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    2 months ago

    and it should have reduced the work as predicted

    The only reason we aren’t approaching Star Trek utopia is because of the unchecked greed fostered by our systems of capitalism.

    There is no reason that, in a world of finite necessary work, increased automation shouldn’t have freed us from the constraints of some of that work.

    The fact that it hasn’t isn’t indictment of automation, it’s indictment of unchecked capitalism.

    • VindictiveJudge@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      Star Trek’s utopia came after economic collapse and a third World War, in that order. So we actually seem to be on track so far.

      • Vespair
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        2 months ago

        I mean, sure, valid, but I am specifically speaking of the end state and don’t personally believe that is the only pathway there, though I do fear much the same as many of us that it might be the most likely.

        • areyouevenreal
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          2 months ago

          At this point war and revolution is probably the only way forward. How else do we get rid of things like capitalism and nationalism?

          • Vespair
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            2 months ago

            Real talk, aside from walking into a voting booth every few years, what actual real world effort have you put into changing the world and system?

            Because I’m gonna be honest, I hear this defeatist sentiment a lot, and it’s almost always from people taking other’s word on the matter, not from the people who are out on the ground enacting real change every day.

            Change isn’t impossible, it’s just hard. You just have to ask yourself if you care enough to put in the effort or if you’re just waiting for revolution because it’s the easy answer.

            • areyouevenreal
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              2 months ago

              I actually used to attend protests, meetings, try and convince people to join back when I was part of a marxist organization. From my perspective all the people on the ground wanted a revolution. I think if you actually looked you would find plenty of people like this. I left for several reasons, including not agreeing with the actions of Leninists in the past, but also because I couldn’t sustain the required time and energy to the cause.

              What do you do to create change? What is your plan? I don’t have a plan anymore, perhaps because I don’t know enough. I am not sure it’s even possible.

              I am not suggesting I have all of the anwsers. I actually think there is a good chance things won’t work out even after a revolution or civil war (see the soviet union for example). I don’t think it’s realistic to expect anything to change without one though. Almost all great leaps forward and changes in regime through history has been through violence and war. This didn’t always improve things either.

              Revolution isn’t an easy answer at all. It seems impossible from my perspective no matter how much I try to tell people it might be necessary. Actually convincing people is extremely hard work and that’s just the start. There are plenty of cases where revolution didn’t work, and plenty of revolutionary ideologies to battle it out. None of this is simple and easy. It might be our only shot though, if we have a shot at all which I doubt very much. Honestly though I think if we do nothing things will collapse eventually anyway. The worst option is things become stagnant and stuck.

      • bluewing
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        2 months ago

        I think if you peer behind the curtain of that utopia, I see the shadowy outline of an authoritarian government controlling it all. And Star Fleet is the iron fist in the velvet glove. The utopia seems to exist to simply keep the masses fat, happy, and controllable.

    • melpomenesclevage
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      2 months ago

      Yep. Kill your masters, or youre killing yourself (and also literally every other living thing becauae climate change)

      There is no third option. I mean, you could ask shitty Jeff to give it all up and srop, just fucking stop, and be an aging beach himbo and fuckerberg to just run a cringe mma gym and maybe contribute to an obscure Linux GUI a couple times a year. But they won’t. Don’t think they can.