Yes, which is why I take issue with the idea that these were not “true Communists.” Some may have taken advantage of their positions, yes, and none of these attempts were or are perfect, but by and large these have been countries made up of the masses attempting to build Communism. The idea that all attempts were merely hijacked by opportunists is an easy way to avoid actually having to analyze them critically. It’s a sort of analytical non-starter.
That is only your view, I can easily say that they were not true communists and still analyse why they were not a true communist systems. If I would say they where truly Communist systems, I would just lie and there would not be failures to analyse since it should have worked since they were truly communist systems.
Because you’re doing a “no true Communism” bit that’s just purity testing, rather than accepting failures of AES as failures of AES and successes of AES as successes of AES.
For me true communism would be living in a group in consensus that nobody owns but the whole group together
Cool, so AES is AES and thus true attempts at Communism.
What is the purpose of Communism? Communism is not “enlightenment” it isn’t a religuous status, it’s a process. Working to put theory to practice, and correct as you go, is Communism.
The achievement of a “Stateless, Classless, Moneyless society,” ie Upper-Stage Communism, as Marx puts it, is a far-future society that has to be worked towards.
So in my mind extremism is bad either way you go and it is not something that anyone should brush off and say “these left wing extremists are fine” because reality never works out that way. Extremism is monstrous either way.
I suspect “true” Communism is something you’ll only find on the pages of a book. Because in reality it goes from being a revolution, to a party, to cliques, to a power struggle, to a purge, to a dictator. And people get shot, tortured, beaten and sent to death camps every step of the way.
Well, of course! We have to learn from every failure any human has done in the past, else we don’t get smarter.
Yes, which is why I take issue with the idea that these were not “true Communists.” Some may have taken advantage of their positions, yes, and none of these attempts were or are perfect, but by and large these have been countries made up of the masses attempting to build Communism. The idea that all attempts were merely hijacked by opportunists is an easy way to avoid actually having to analyze them critically. It’s a sort of analytical non-starter.
That is only your view, I can easily say that they were not true communists and still analyse why they were not a true communist systems. If I would say they where truly Communist systems, I would just lie and there would not be failures to analyse since it should have worked since they were truly communist systems.
That’s a lot of nonsense if you aren’t going to actually analyze anything.
What is “true” Communism?
😂how to get to that I don’t analyse?
For me true communism would be living in a group in consensus that nobody owns but the whole group together
Because you’re doing a “no true Communism” bit that’s just purity testing, rather than accepting failures of AES as failures of AES and successes of AES as successes of AES.
Cool, so AES is AES and thus true attempts at Communism.
True attempt to achieve communism is not the same as achieving true communism, I’d say…
Why?
What is the purpose of Communism? Communism is not “enlightenment” it isn’t a religuous status, it’s a process. Working to put theory to practice, and correct as you go, is Communism.
The achievement of a “Stateless, Classless, Moneyless society,” ie Upper-Stage Communism, as Marx puts it, is a far-future society that has to be worked towards.
I don’t think current “AES” really work in the direction “stateless” nor "classless”. Maybe “moneyless” I could see that.
But I absolutely agree that the achievement of an upper-stage Communism would be fabulous
I suspect “true” Communism is something you’ll only find on the pages of a book. Because in reality it goes from being a revolution, to a party, to cliques, to a power struggle, to a purge, to a dictator. And people get shot, tortured, beaten and sent to death camps every step of the way.