No but lemmy is full of folks who only see police as an agent of class war who’s core action is to extract money from citizens while abusing their autonomy.
The police are enforcers of the law. When was the last time a law was drafted and enacted by the poor? And why is it that the well connected and rich seem to play by different laws.
I like, that im Finland, traffic fines are based on your income, so that if your poor, it stings but if your rich, it’ll also sting. The largest fine for speeding was over 120k Euros.
Again I’m just playing the role here but they’d reply:
"Yes, I was forced into a car based, capitalist system by birth and shouldnt have had to drive for coffee. The road was engineered to encourage speeding and cops are part of the system. Their giving me a ticket is just wealth extraction from those forced to engage in a system they didn’t choose. "
Are the police less awful and corrupt in other countries? I mean there is a need for traffic enforcement but I question whether the police are the right tool for the job, at least in their current form.
In today’s world I believe the only way you get away from police doing the traffic enforcement, is if you let a private company do it, with whatever means they feel like (AI cameras, mercenary “officers”, etc. )
And you can bet it’ll be 100% profit driven.
That’s because in our society we cede all authority to either privately owned or state organizations, so that’s all we can imagine. I’d prefer public safety to be more community-led. We don’t have a lot of existing models for this yet but that doesn’t mean it’s not possible.
I’m saying public safety activities should be executed by and accountable to the communities they operate in. Current police organizations only make token gestures towards this ideal.
HOAs are kind of their own weird monstrosity but they aren’t structured in a healthy way due to being tied to home ownership and their primary purpose being the protection of home prices.
I feel safer with a German police officer than with an American one. This being said I can’t imagine an alternative tool. Anyone given the tools needed to stop and punish dangerous drivers would just be police by another name.
I think the organizational structure, available tools, and level of oversight can make a hugely different enforcement system. Frankly I’d like to see traffic enforcement that is way more automated. I know people hate traffic cameras but they’re usually more fair than the police and way less likely to murder you.
Here in Germany we mostly use traffic cameras to enforce speeding laws.
Unless you are driving way too fast you will most likely not get pulled over by police, instead some police officers set up mobile (and well hidden) traffic cameras in problematic areas which will fine anyone going too fast.
We do still have some traffic police, but we dont have as many as in the US.
They will pull you over if they think you are under the influence or because your car has illegal modifications or is broken in an unsafe way.
I cannot believe that people in the US can just modify their vehicle or let its condition deteiorate so much that it is unsafe and its completely legal.
That is not the case here in Germany and it does probably help make it safer, even if some people, who would do a safe modification, cannot do it because its too hard to get it certified.
Completely legal might be a bit of a stretch, but yes, I agree. It feels like most officers have more crazy stuff to handle in a day that they don’t want to take the time out of their day for smaller violations in my town. Around here you don’t get pulled over for only ten over.
I think automation is an acceptable path. But I think we still would need some organization with legal authority. We can’t just fine people later for drunk driving. They need to be stoped asap even against their will. Same goes for people grossly speeding or even elderly people who can’t drive safely even though they think they can. Given your other posts this organization can be community lead. This being said any community lead organization with such a legal mandate would just be police under another name.
I’m not sure the solution of swarming our streets with cops is really better than the current problem. It seems like it would just shift indiscriminate traffic violence towards discriminatory violence against rule breakers, POC, or whoever upsets the cops. Maybe if we had a better organization capable of doing this but my sense is the police don’t really perform this function right now anyway. At least where I live there’s little to no traffic enforcement as is.
Another big aspect I didn’t mention is designing roads that prevent people from behaving badly in the first place. A system that depends on good behavior or the very unlikely event of getting pulled over was never going to work.
Is Lemmy full of sovereign citizens now days? In all countries when you commit traffic violations you get a ticket.
Police do a lot wrong but enforcing driving safety is not one of those.
No but lemmy is full of folks who only see police as an agent of class war who’s core action is to extract money from citizens while abusing their autonomy.
No gray! Only black and white!
The police are enforcers of the law. When was the last time a law was drafted and enacted by the poor? And why is it that the well connected and rich seem to play by different laws.
deleted by creator
I like, that im Finland, traffic fines are based on your income, so that if your poor, it stings but if your rich, it’ll also sting. The largest fine for speeding was over 120k Euros.
Hey you’re good
I agree with your statement that it’s not black or white. But there’s some severe misalignment of punishment going on from class to race.
Completely agree.
These are people who got a speeding ticket from that massive dick who had the gall to stop the person when they were LATE FOR GETTING COFFEE. GAWD!
…and now must anecdote the planet as to how evil that cop was.
Again I’m just playing the role here but they’d reply:
"Yes, I was forced into a car based, capitalist system by birth and shouldnt have had to drive for coffee. The road was engineered to encourage speeding and cops are part of the system. Their giving me a ticket is just wealth extraction from those forced to engage in a system they didn’t choose. "
Blech
Don’t forget that all police are direct descendants of slave catchers and we can get rid of all police with no consequences
Are the police less awful and corrupt in other countries? I mean there is a need for traffic enforcement but I question whether the police are the right tool for the job, at least in their current form.
I feel safe being stopped by German police.
I feel uneasy being stopped by American police.
I feel my sphincter contract like never before being stopped by Brazilian police.
In today’s world I believe the only way you get away from police doing the traffic enforcement, is if you let a private company do it, with whatever means they feel like (AI cameras, mercenary “officers”, etc. ) And you can bet it’ll be 100% profit driven.
That’s because in our society we cede all authority to either privately owned or state organizations, so that’s all we can imagine. I’d prefer public safety to be more community-led. We don’t have a lot of existing models for this yet but that doesn’t mean it’s not possible.
Yes. Police. Where the hell do you think cops live?
Or did you mean vigilantes who got bored of being HoA Karens?
As of 2014, 94% of Minneapolis Police officers didn’t live in Minneapolis.. According to the article, the national average for that statistic is 40% which is still awful, and I doubt it’s improved much.
I’m saying public safety activities should be executed by and accountable to the communities they operate in. Current police organizations only make token gestures towards this ideal.
HOAs are kind of their own weird monstrosity but they aren’t structured in a healthy way due to being tied to home ownership and their primary purpose being the protection of home prices.
I feel safer with a German police officer than with an American one. This being said I can’t imagine an alternative tool. Anyone given the tools needed to stop and punish dangerous drivers would just be police by another name.
I think the organizational structure, available tools, and level of oversight can make a hugely different enforcement system. Frankly I’d like to see traffic enforcement that is way more automated. I know people hate traffic cameras but they’re usually more fair than the police and way less likely to murder you.
Here in Germany we mostly use traffic cameras to enforce speeding laws. Unless you are driving way too fast you will most likely not get pulled over by police, instead some police officers set up mobile (and well hidden) traffic cameras in problematic areas which will fine anyone going too fast.
We do still have some traffic police, but we dont have as many as in the US. They will pull you over if they think you are under the influence or because your car has illegal modifications or is broken in an unsafe way.
I cannot believe that people in the US can just modify their vehicle or let its condition deteiorate so much that it is unsafe and its completely legal.
That is not the case here in Germany and it does probably help make it safer, even if some people, who would do a safe modification, cannot do it because its too hard to get it certified.
Completely legal might be a bit of a stretch, but yes, I agree. It feels like most officers have more crazy stuff to handle in a day that they don’t want to take the time out of their day for smaller violations in my town. Around here you don’t get pulled over for only ten over.
I think automation is an acceptable path. But I think we still would need some organization with legal authority. We can’t just fine people later for drunk driving. They need to be stoped asap even against their will. Same goes for people grossly speeding or even elderly people who can’t drive safely even though they think they can. Given your other posts this organization can be community lead. This being said any community lead organization with such a legal mandate would just be police under another name.
I’m not sure the solution of swarming our streets with cops is really better than the current problem. It seems like it would just shift indiscriminate traffic violence towards discriminatory violence against rule breakers, POC, or whoever upsets the cops. Maybe if we had a better organization capable of doing this but my sense is the police don’t really perform this function right now anyway. At least where I live there’s little to no traffic enforcement as is.
Another big aspect I didn’t mention is designing roads that prevent people from behaving badly in the first place. A system that depends on good behavior or the very unlikely event of getting pulled over was never going to work.
Driving safety can be enforced with a mailed fine. Traffic stops pretty much shouldn’t exist.
What about gross speeding or drunk driving?
Those are both criminal offense, not traffic violations. I’ve got no problem with criminal stops.
Straight to jail.
100%