He is someone who already transitioned (transmasc) and still enjoys wearing feminine clothing, what the girl did here can feel very very invalidating and dysphoria inducing because despite passing she still sees them as a girl. For me situations like that make me feel hella dysphoric.
I’m in femboy communities and I know many of them also dislike when this happens to them as well, but it doesn’t compare to the gender dysphoria I get from people still thinking I’m a girl.
I agree that we really do need to discuss gender identity and presentation separate from transition, I also think we need to discuss presentation separate from gender identity, after all if boys are allowed to wear skirts, why do people naturally assume we must be girls if/when we do?
I didn’t realize there was deep lore in an egg_irl post, i took it as the comic it was.
Without that background information, (that is not included unless i stalk the OP, which doesn’t feel like it would endear anyone to my participation) it feels close to a comic could reinforce the “you can’t win trying to be supportive to queer people these days” energy since there’s nothing clear about there being a boundary made by the other person in the comic? Maybe there’s something i missed on the lemmy ui, I’m willing to admit!
As an older queer i am not quite sure when we decided clothing meant anything (again) since growing up it was something we already tried to work on in the queer community, just look into lesbian spaces and their attempts to uncouple femininity from being required to dress up. Have binary identities and enforcing trans people to present a particular way backfired into hyper gendered expressions being required?
Another question is how can the community help individuals vulnerable to invalidation of parts of their identity? I know everyone needs support as a whole and in general in their lives. The ability to stand strong in yourself in the storm can’t be manufactured without a foundation, and how do we help newbies find that with the atmospheres as tense as they are, even in queer spaces?
It’s okay, I forgot to mark it as Transmasc and Transphobia. Without that there’s no way anyone else could’ve known.
I never intended to have that message, was just trying to share a situation which was uncomfortable and invalidating for me due to someone else assuming my gender (thinking I am AMAB transfem when I’m AFAB and transmasc).
I don’t know if as you said binary identities and expectations of trans people have backfired as you said, I do know that people who follow gender stereotypes have had a tendency sort of force them onto others. It happens a lot to femboys and people say they are an egg or transfem. Which isn’t great on its own but in my case I’m a femboy and transmasc so it’s worse.
It’s hard but I think that having such rigid expectations of presentation isn’t helping. Like, so what if I was AMAB and looked and dressed the way I am, so what. Why would that make me a girl or egg? That doesn’t seem helpful, and at least for an AMAB femboy it wouldn’t be exactly harmful, it’s not always obvious that they are. I’ve met many enbies who had similar experiences with invalidation from gender stereotypes and it sucks.
It’s really strange bc before like 2016 there were a lot of things no one cared about and wasnt being as gendered anymore that have suddenly really come back?
Like it’s funny, I have nonbinary friends who have never had their presentation be a thing really say in the past few years that a hair style or a way they dress flags people as “an other” and suddenly bigots are trying to make guesses about what’s between their legs along with supportive but ignorant ppl making assumptions but accepting corrections about pronouns and stuff.
But like i know a feminine presenting cis woman who was asked if she was trans because she has a shaved head. Like other than that she’s completely gender conforming. She’s shaved for a better part of a decade and lives in a progressive place and it NEVER came up before two years ago.
I mean i cant be mad for her cause it was a progressive person asking who is also queer, right? But also it was so strange to us both that it just takes ONE (to me minor) flag now? For ppl to make guesses? A shaved head hadnt been as gendered for a while!
Then there’s ppl like… I have a close friend (was living in the south us at the time) who had their friends taking literal bets bc the friend group “couldn’t decide” what their AGAB was. Why it matters doesn’t make sense to me to this day!
Idk what the total solution is, but really gendering things never has made sense to me. As ive gotten older i find my gender presentation is neither/both and the details of which are solely for anyone i am in an intimate relationship with lol
![egg😣irl [Transmasc] [CW: Transphobia]](https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/pictrs/image/bf39ba1f-b01c-43fd-b899-79756511c574.webp){kind=link}
He is someone who already transitioned (transmasc) and still enjoys wearing feminine clothing, what the girl did here can feel very very invalidating and dysphoria inducing because despite passing she still sees them as a girl. For me situations like that make me feel hella dysphoric.
I’m in femboy communities and I know many of them also dislike when this happens to them as well, but it doesn’t compare to the gender dysphoria I get from people still thinking I’m a girl.
I agree that we really do need to discuss gender identity and presentation separate from transition, I also think we need to discuss presentation separate from gender identity, after all if boys are allowed to wear skirts, why do people naturally assume we must be girls if/when we do?
I didn’t realize there was deep lore in an egg_irl post, i took it as the comic it was.
Without that background information, (that is not included unless i stalk the OP, which doesn’t feel like it would endear anyone to my participation) it feels close to a comic could reinforce the “you can’t win trying to be supportive to queer people these days” energy since there’s nothing clear about there being a boundary made by the other person in the comic? Maybe there’s something i missed on the lemmy ui, I’m willing to admit!
As an older queer i am not quite sure when we decided clothing meant anything (again) since growing up it was something we already tried to work on in the queer community, just look into lesbian spaces and their attempts to uncouple femininity from being required to dress up. Have binary identities and enforcing trans people to present a particular way backfired into hyper gendered expressions being required?
Another question is how can the community help individuals vulnerable to invalidation of parts of their identity? I know everyone needs support as a whole and in general in their lives. The ability to stand strong in yourself in the storm can’t be manufactured without a foundation, and how do we help newbies find that with the atmospheres as tense as they are, even in queer spaces?
It’s okay, I forgot to mark it as Transmasc and Transphobia. Without that there’s no way anyone else could’ve known.
I never intended to have that message, was just trying to share a situation which was uncomfortable and invalidating for me due to someone else assuming my gender (thinking I am AMAB transfem when I’m AFAB and transmasc).
I don’t know if as you said binary identities and expectations of trans people have backfired as you said, I do know that people who follow gender stereotypes have had a tendency sort of force them onto others. It happens a lot to femboys and people say they are an egg or transfem. Which isn’t great on its own but in my case I’m a femboy and transmasc so it’s worse.
It’s hard but I think that having such rigid expectations of presentation isn’t helping. Like, so what if I was AMAB and looked and dressed the way I am, so what. Why would that make me a girl or egg? That doesn’t seem helpful, and at least for an AMAB femboy it wouldn’t be exactly harmful, it’s not always obvious that they are. I’ve met many enbies who had similar experiences with invalidation from gender stereotypes and it sucks.
It’s really strange bc before like 2016 there were a lot of things no one cared about and wasnt being as gendered anymore that have suddenly really come back?
Like it’s funny, I have nonbinary friends who have never had their presentation be a thing really say in the past few years that a hair style or a way they dress flags people as “an other” and suddenly bigots are trying to make guesses about what’s between their legs along with supportive but ignorant ppl making assumptions but accepting corrections about pronouns and stuff.
But like i know a feminine presenting cis woman who was asked if she was trans because she has a shaved head. Like other than that she’s completely gender conforming. She’s shaved for a better part of a decade and lives in a progressive place and it NEVER came up before two years ago.
I mean i cant be mad for her cause it was a progressive person asking who is also queer, right? But also it was so strange to us both that it just takes ONE (to me minor) flag now? For ppl to make guesses? A shaved head hadnt been as gendered for a while!
Then there’s ppl like… I have a close friend (was living in the south us at the time) who had their friends taking literal bets bc the friend group “couldn’t decide” what their AGAB was. Why it matters doesn’t make sense to me to this day!
Idk what the total solution is, but really gendering things never has made sense to me. As ive gotten older i find my gender presentation is neither/both and the details of which are solely for anyone i am in an intimate relationship with lol