I wish I were on the drugs you are to find the reason in the obviously logically flawed and contradictory madness you keep making of this.
But if you need to keep telling yourself that espionage is OK just because some governments engage in some forms of mass surveillance, then I can’t stop you from making a fool of yourself by saying so. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I still think that both are bad, and I still find it pretty easy to argue both points without conflating the two logically fallaciously.
Thing is, even if we don’t agree, I think you could do better arguing either or both points without conflating the two. And I think you’d be more convincing, if you didn’t rely on conflating them. That’s what I’m trying to say, is that you’re not really wrong on one point, the other is logically fallacious, but that you’re wrong for trying to say that they’re related.
What did Edward Snowden do, if not technically espionage? Some other crime?
Sometimes, it’s good to do crimes. The more oppressive the government, generally speaking, then more good things might get turned into crimes. Criticism of the government. Protest. Etc.
It was espionage. And then, like a coward, he ran into the arms of our greatest enemy, because he knew what he did was wrong, and couldn’t face the consequences. Chelsea Manning, on the other hand, had the bravery to stand up for what she did, And had her sentence commuted.
I said that what Snowden did was espionage. When he ran from the consequences of his actions, that made him a coward. Since he ran to Russia, it makes me suspicious that he’s also a traitor. I did explain that. Now, I have explained it again. I did not make any moral evaluation, but if you need to put words in my mouth to make your argument, your argument can’t be that strong.
And the fact that Manning was mistreated by the at one point, and then later had her sentence commuted is only evidence that the US government itself is not the faceless and single minded monolith you make it out to be. If you need to constantly mischaracterize the US government in order to make your point, your argument can’t be as strong as you claim it to be.
If you’re gonna bother replying at all, try saying something factual for once rather than couching your arguments in half truths and twisted words.
“Espionage” - Ed Snowden leaking PRISM docs
“Paranoia” - reading about it on Wikipedia
You’re the only one who mentioned Edward Snowden
You’re right, I mentioned it because it seemed like a good counterexample to your reasoning.
… Apparently you agree?
I wish I were on the drugs you are to find the reason in the obviously logically flawed and contradictory madness you keep making of this.
But if you need to keep telling yourself that espionage is OK just because some governments engage in some forms of mass surveillance, then I can’t stop you from making a fool of yourself by saying so. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I still think that both are bad, and I still find it pretty easy to argue both points without conflating the two logically fallaciously.
Thing is, even if we don’t agree, I think you could do better arguing either or both points without conflating the two. And I think you’d be more convincing, if you didn’t rely on conflating them. That’s what I’m trying to say, is that you’re not really wrong on one point, the other is logically fallacious, but that you’re wrong for trying to say that they’re related.
What did Edward Snowden do, if not technically espionage? Some other crime?
Sometimes, it’s good to do crimes. The more oppressive the government, generally speaking, then more good things might get turned into crimes. Criticism of the government. Protest. Etc.
It was espionage. And then, like a coward, he ran into the arms of our greatest enemy, because he knew what he did was wrong, and couldn’t face the consequences. Chelsea Manning, on the other hand, had the bravery to stand up for what she did, And had her sentence commuted.
Be careful who you praise as your heroes.
Okay, so if you think what Edward Snowden did was wrong, you should have said that and explained why it was wrong.
Chelsea Manning was tortured by the US government, so I’m not sure why you are holding her up as an example that The System works.
I said that what Snowden did was espionage. When he ran from the consequences of his actions, that made him a coward. Since he ran to Russia, it makes me suspicious that he’s also a traitor. I did explain that. Now, I have explained it again. I did not make any moral evaluation, but if you need to put words in my mouth to make your argument, your argument can’t be that strong.
And the fact that Manning was mistreated by the at one point, and then later had her sentence commuted is only evidence that the US government itself is not the faceless and single minded monolith you make it out to be. If you need to constantly mischaracterize the US government in order to make your point, your argument can’t be as strong as you claim it to be.
If you’re gonna bother replying at all, try saying something factual for once rather than couching your arguments in half truths and twisted words.
LOL
Tortured
I don’t