England certainly didn’t help, but…
Understatement of the century.
It’s interesting to compare India and China since both have huge populations and gained independence at the same time. Personally, I really do think it comes down to governance and central planning, where the dictatorship of the proletariat and central planning is more suitable to developing a large semi-feudal state than liberal democratic squabbling.
Literacy programs. Mao’s literacy programs meant that the Chinese peasantry were able to take on new roles in a developing nation. It’s not that everyone in China went on to become a brain surgeon but the ability to recieve and obey written instructions makes people far more productive
India’s caste system means there was never as much interest in making some people literate and the country paid for that. There are parts of India that were ran by Maoists at the time of Mao’s literacy programs and they are considerably better off
In some ways yes, but China managing to hold on to nominal independence and partially modernise in the late 19th century/early 20th century helped, compared to India which was forcibly de-industrialised. Having all your machines carted to England and your skilled tradesmen and artisans reduced to serfdom for 150 years is a hell of a setback. One that even the chaos of the Opium Wars, Collapse, and the Warlord era can’t quite match.
China murdering the landowners rather than paying them off also helped.
Not sure if the colonial occupation of India is quite comparable to the carnage China saw in the first half of the 20th century. The boxer Rebellion, three revolutions, the warlord era and Japanese genocide during WWII and then the violence of the civil war afterwards.
India had repeated famines sure, but I don’t really think you can argue they were worse off than China at the time of independence.
The chaos of 19th and early 20th century China was utterly horrific, but there’s a difference between wild chaos that destroys, co opts, or forces capital and labour to lie fallow, and the systematic, planned, comprehensive dismatling of that capability over an entire nation for more than a century.
Which the British did in India, they deliberately reduced a nation with an early industrial revolution economy back to pre industry and further, to pure agrarianism.
To openly be a skilled textile worker in 1850s India was about as safe as being a Cathar in medieval France.
China murdering the landowners rather than paying them off also helped.
No shortage of dead landlords in India, depending on when and where you were standing. But the Mao/Deng/Hu/Xi era has cultivated a very different kind of domestic self-sufficiency than the modern Modi state that simply exists to serve Western interests.
partially modernise in the late 19th century/early 20th century
i’d say the level of ‘modernization’ in China would’ve been a rough parity or even less than India overall. in both cases most the rail was built to serve imperial interests, like the most developed system in Manchuria—but China had 27k km of lines in 1945 vs. probably a bit less than 77k in india (when they reorganized it in 1951, can’t find earlier overall figures). i’d say most of the progress from the late Qing was more-or-less erased in the warlord era & japanese invasion
i mean it was to the point colonial-developed Manchuria is seen as a big advantage for the Communists to acquire (which btw the Soviets didn’t “hand over”, i don’t know who started that myth the GMT occupied most of it but lost it in early fighting)
My point is that unlike China, India was “deindustrialised” over the 19th century from a fairly advanced 18th century economy.
They had approx same amounts of 19th century tech, sure, but China still had a large base of skilled artisans that could bootstrap internal development of production, while India had a much more vestigial capacity.
China still had a large base of skilled artisans that could bootstrap internal development of production
did they though? China wasn’t industrialized yet but forcibly opened up as a market for western goods. their attempts at building a domestic industrial base were disrupted by the warlords & japan. i don’t think there was a nucleic handicraft economy waiting to develop into an industrial one, at least not outside of the most remote places which factory products had never reached.
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interior factors
If they say it’s not a systemic cause, an external cause, they’re being racist. Because the only option left is “internal”, there being something inherently wrong with the group of people they’re talking about.
Economic or societal factor are a thing and would be internal. It doesn’t have to be about race…
Doesn’t have to be, but in this case it absolutely is. I grew up hearing enough screeds about those people and their toxic violent culture to recognize the language racists use when they want to be a littlle bit deniable.
I look like that
So easily could’ve just left the first paragraph out lol
When you use so many micro aggressions in one post that it becomes macro aggression
I’m just so tired of hearing how every corner of the earth in some kind of abnormally high crime wave.
India’s in a crime wave. London is in a crime wave. Peoria, Illinois is in a crime wave. I am once again begging to live in the world these people think we live in, where everyone has an utter contempt for civil law and they’re all doing crimes all the time with impunity.
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Dunno if I’d call it a wave so much as an unending torrent.
Sure, but we all know that’s not what is being talked about.
i saw some post from a canadian about a crime wave hitting their city and they had like, the second to last lowest crime rate in north america
They heard that someone from the next town over knew someone that might’ve had their catalytic converter stolen. Bam, crime wave.
nah i bet you they saw an indigenous person and flipped the fuck out
Someone once accused me of shoplifting from the store, though in reality i forgot my reusable bags in the car and just walked away with my stuff in my hands after using the self checkout. You could see the receipt in my fingers. Insanely racist country.
wait what’s going on in india?
Far right hindu nationalism and anti muslim violence.
Far right […] nationalism and anti muslim violence.
Weird, Reddit loves those things when white countries do them
when white
When white. Though to be honest up to few months ago Biden was fawning to Modi at each opportunity, until it became obvious India want to play both sides and not become blind US puppet against Russia and China.
:
but for oppressing muslims. When it’s the USA or Israel, they will never mention it. But China or other baddy non white countries had better not oppress Muslims or 
will pretend to care
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I heard it’s also extended to violence against other non Hindu religious groups as well lately
This is the thread (CW: death): https://old.reddit.com/r/CatastrophicFailure/comments/17fqiur/another_bridge_fall_in_india_gujarat_october_2023/
content warning on that video for anyone wondering what happens in it
Added it. Thanks.
Idk ask treecentric, seems like they have a really foggy idea
i meant more the other user saying shit about india activating purge mode, but i guess it’s just usual “brown ppl bad” shit
It could be about the countless lynchings hinduvtas emboldened by Modi have been carrying out against indian Muslims.
Unfortunately it’s just standard brown people backwards/uncivilized shit
“Indoctrinated by Modi”
Don’t you idiots cheer on Modi? Or do you deep down realize that you’re the real savages when you see non-whites sometimes act like you?
Don’t you idiots cheer on Modi?
Looks like the answer is “No.”Ah, I need to keep remembering that simpsons meme with the US flag that says “No one is allowed to commit war crimes but me, and maybe the boy.” pointing to Israel.
I mean, Modi isn’t helping, but it’s not like he cast a spell on the population to make so many of them Hindu Nationalists, or is singularly a bigger influence than colonization was.
1 politician significant for the past ~20 years or the traumatic destruction of a country arbitrarily divided into three by the British as punishment for independence, i wonder what could have greater consequences for nationalist movements on the indian subcontinent
It’s a capitalist developing country, and shares exactly the same problems all the other capitalist developing countries share.
It starting in the same place, with the same population and the same level of development as China, and unlike all the other communists in the world China’s growth was unchecked thanks to Deng. The difference between communist development and capitalist development is laid bare by the difference between the two.
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ALL THOSE NATURAL RESOURCES pure projection
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