Sounds like they unified against you fairly well.
That they did.
I’ve only experienced that from them since I’ve known them. Not one wants a good faith discussion until you grovel to their fundamentalist tripe. Unity to them means blindly following their half-understood theories of centuries-dead men, and anyone who questions a lick of it gets the 4chan swarm treatment.
OP literally did not attempt to have any discussion of any kind, and explicitly said they had no interest in doing so
that’s the definition of “not in good faith” homie
Can’t exactly have a good faith argument if the post gets brigaded.
No, good faith argument is being a debatelord, as was explained to me at length in the last post. People who just happen to see the post and respond are all brigading if they come from an instance that has a cross-post. Them’s the rules.
Don’t bullshit me that there is a proper way to argue with that fucker, he demonstrated at length that there was not.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen a sealion so mad before.
Fuck off, all you can do is call names and be smug, there is no point talking to you
I’ve never seen an Inco DeNiro Factsum Glish Galoop Slish Slosh No True Strawman Fallacy used so blantantly
-Le Epic Redditeur
Strawman
This isn’t fucking reddit, “brigading” is not a real thing.
Why can’t an OP have a good faith argument if the post gets “brigaded”? That doesn’t really make sense to me. Anyone can choose to argue in good faith regardless of how the other party behaves.
Well for several reasons.
-
You have to find someone who actually wants to have a good faith argument with you.
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You have to be disciplined enough to only argue with them, as you will expend energy arguing with the 500 other commenters who are just trolling you.
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Actually be able to go through your inbox and find the replies of the person you think is actually acting in good faith.
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Be in the mood to argue in good faith. Which is unlikely from the begining, basically impossible at the end.
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Can’t have a good faith argument with people we have no faith in. Eat shit
Obviously.
Faith is earned, OP tipped the scale against themselves real fast.
Yeah it’s almost like OP uno reversed
what part of db0’s crosspost was calling for good faith discussion? Did you look at it? https://lemmy.ml/comment/5783449
Don’t be mad db0 sank to your level. Get dunked on or whatever
I didn’t. Pretty based tho, ngl. Did you cry about it?
You’re a dweeb and should quit posting.
When they don’t have a counterargument, they attack your character. It shows just how strong their foundation of understanding is that a simple debate or differing viewpoint is a dire threat to their entire worldview. It’s extremely pathetic tbh.
I think they just observed that you generally ignored the counterarguments and correctly concluded that presenting yet another to you is absurd, but of course you pick that as the comment you respond to
Also calling someone a dweeb isn’t a character attack, like calling them a moron isn’t.
I’d fucking love to talk with someone here on terms of argument and counterargument, but that is considered “sealioning” by every fucker I’ve encountered so far on this worthless anarcho-bidenist instance
Any form of name-calling or declaration in regards to the individual and not the subject of debate is an appeal to character, and is the last resort of those who can’t support their claim, second to violence.
If I have “ignored” responses, it is because my app has not notified me that I have a response to a comment. To my knowledge, I have responded in-kind to every comment regarding this post, and even if I hadn’t, one cannot be compelled to respond to every argument or point. It is entirely reasonable for me, on my own judgement, to deem a reply to be a waste of time or nothing worth adding to or drawing attention toward.
Lastly, if you would like to make a claim and prove good faith, please do so here or in DMs. I would love to discuss philosophy and ethics. But let’s do so in our own words. Quoting Manifestos will be just as effective to a productive discussion as quoting religious scripture. Convince me. Don’t beat me with a dead man’s words.
I’m an anarchist and you’re just an idiot.
Oh wow, I’ve never disagreed with an anarchist before!
how can you seriously call anybody a smuglord in that convo except you
“Uh uh, I’m not the smuglord, you’re the smuglord!”
that’s exactly what you did
does the work of the feds by intentionally seeding distrust between leftists
gets called a fed by leftists
“time to fill my diaper about it!”
The fact that you numbskulls don’t even realize how significant fedjacketing is and why we don’t do it, just says everything one needs to know.
it’s not fedjacketing to say you are being their good little dog with this childish bullshit. i don’t think you’re being paid. i think you’re a goofy asshole who needs to leave their bedroom
I think you need to leave my bedroom first!
In light of this compelling new evidence, I’m updating my hypothesis from “need for attention” to “humiliation fetish”.
Seems about right.
This is so tedious
This was what you posted https://i.imgur.com/RDl2sOZ.png
That was the version revised to be less racist, not the initial post
I’m at least pleasantly surprised they actually tried to do the bare minimum of editing it to be less racist.
Credit where it’s due and all that
Thanks for single handily crashing the housing market by allowing millions of hexbear users to live rent free in your head.
“Millions” 😂
Well it works for us on Hexbear. That’s actually what I like about it, it’s a nice big tent over there. Some of our greatest posters are anarchists, they were indispensable on the frontline of the posting wars that followed federation.
Remember when we ruined that TERFs career?
Or when @Eugene_V_Dabs@hexbear.net and I made a meme that got me reported to the FBI?
Some people simply cannot handle being told they’re wrong
Looking forward to your next meme about how bed time is Fascism.
Hey so I think you’re pretty rad person who’s obviously investing a lot of effort in setting up cool communities and making tools to keep them safe.
I also think you got unfairly dogpiled in a pretty frustrating way.
But further, it seemed to me you were not trying to de-escalate there. I know the hexbear dogpile can be a bit ridiculous (honestly that place confuses me, I see both the absolute sanest and most unhinged posts coming out of hexbear users) but at this point you are definitely feeding the trolls.
I get that this might be fun for you, but it does use up a lot of bandwidth in the community and I worry it harms the quality of conversations we might be able to have in the future.
Once again I want to be clear that this remark comes from a place of respect, you obviously care about fostering online community and hence this last couple of days is confusing to me.
New copypasta
I appreciate your effort to be diplomatic
You might want to reconsider your idea of what they care about, though.
I’m not sure if you’re aware but db0 has been working on CSAM filtering, safe federation lists and similar.
Maybe cut them some slack? That’s certainly more work than I put in.
They can be praised and thanked for their actions in one instance and criticized for their actions in other instances.
I didn’t remember, though if this is the AI guy then I did read the post. I still need to question the deeply antisocial behavior patterns when it comes to anything having to do with communication, though.
Not that we shouldn’t give them credit for whatever good they do, we should.
I think you’re being a bit hyperbolic generalising deeply antisocial communication habits from a stupid flame war.
I mean how many dozens of times does a behavior need to be demonstrated before we can call ot a pattern?
I think it would be more useful if you read the rest of the thread than I rehash my thoughts
Even just a ballpark number would be nice.
When someone is posting enough to be nearly half the flame war, including resurrecting it in a new thread because they just need the attention ig, it provides a pretty large data set.
It’s understand the concern. This is just how I deal with this stuff myself. I can absorb a lot off abusive behaviour but I have to blow off some steam somehow, and this is my way.
Unlike what hexbears might say, I’m not trying to goad them. Notice that I never went out of my way to invite their dogpiles.
I’m not trying to goad them. Notice that I never went out of my way to invite their dogpiles.
My sweet little pain piggy, you keep letting out clarion calls that summons all the silly bears out of every nook and cranny of the lemmynet
Cmon Y’all are adults (at least, I hope)
If you behave like a smart alek kid, expect to be scolded like one.
I’ll always enjoy seeing smuglords being patronizing in public.
Holy shit! 2 “I’m rubber, you’re glue” replies to the same comment . That must be some form of achievement.
Should stop staring at your mirror in public then, you might step in an open manhole like a loony toons character
Shut up
Unlike what hexbears might say, I’m not trying to goad them.
You literally put the hexbear logo in the whiny little meme you’ve posted here.
You’re not fooling anyone with your reddit-tier bs lmao
I think if I get called redditor once I more I might legit be moved
l o l
We are explicitly a left unity community and Your first (racist) meme was explicitly against left unity and you literally included our logo in this one. If that isn’t goading us what would be in your eyes?
Yeah idk you defs don’t want spaces dominated by the norms of whoever is the most annoying. I’ve wasted far too much time at meetings with certain pot stirrers interjecting with their own little axe at every chance.
I’m just very weary of fostering tribalism and shit slinging in a time when the left is roundly loosing in the majority of the most powerful countries.
Eh the death of the left has been greatly exaggerated. Sure parliamentary left is “losing” but parliamentary left was worse than useless anyway. Spare no tears for that. Struggle breeds radicalization and if you are looking you will see that the embers are already flaming.
Anyway I’m not trying to do tribalism. I could have easily followed the trend and defederated if that was my goal. I actually like the chance to be criticized from the left. I’m not perfect. But I do have some strong convictions as well.
Anyway I’m not trying to do tribalism
That’s literally all I have ever seen from you.
Is that why you’re allowed to comment in my tribal lands with buddies while I am responding alone? Hell of a tribe I have made!
You’re turning no one agreeing with you into aggrievement
Does this gish galloping ever work? Just take everything out of context and erect a strawman from it? I seen it way too often from y’all
“I actually like the chance to be criticized from the left.“
Is this a joke? Every good faith criticism you have received from the left you act as if it is some dog pile attack and like you didn’t invite this debate with your first extremely divisive (and racist) meme. You kept repeating Ad Nauseum that you “didn’t owe anyone a debate” and telling us we’re “sea lioning”. Guess what dipshit? You know what criticism from the left is going to feel like: A DEBATE!
In what way does that behavior demonstrate that you are in any way open to left criticism? I presume you just conveniently omit anyone who you see as a “Tankie” from “the left” you are ok being criticized by.
You are a terminally reddit brained person who colors themself as an Anarchist because you like the aesthetic. You are happy to punch left and carry water for Imperialism because it gives you some individualistic and smug sense of moral correctness. That feeling is obviously more important to you than understanding AES states on their terms and learning from what they did right and what they did wrong without moralizing like the child that you are.
Your convictions are as strong as apple sauce. These two posts have made it abundantly clear to me that without some fucking humility, self Crit, and willingness to engage with other leftists who disagree with you (re: DEBATE) you are the kind of “leftist” who would sell out a successful left wing movement if there ever was one because they were “too authoritarian”
If Hexbear users are so bad do us a favor and de-federate because this is clearly a waste of everyone’s time and energy.
I could have easily followed the trend and defederated if that was my goal.
This is very awesome of you I must say. I was hoping some real friendship from both sides could happen here.
Huh?
What?
I don’t see how you see friendships forming
You kicked the extremist groupthink hornet’s nest by mentioning them. Whenever I give one of them shit, 10 more show up out of the woodwork.
at this point you are definitely feeding the trolls
OP is the troll
i rolled my eyes at the first thread and didnt open but i wanted to leave a comment here so you have more evidence when u write about your struggle in the future
I’m not sure I really agree with your first point, I think finding a way to find allys in all leftists would be worth it, even if it has a dark history. Things can be better.
But holy shit their reaction was intense. And the idea that their arguments were in defense of left unity was pretty silly… 99% of it was just “anarchists wrong and evil”, and there is wild amounts of sectarianism going on just within hexbear that I’m sure lent energy to this.
I respect how you reacted under pressure. I really respect any admin of a website that can show that much restraint when dealing with personal attacks and people you explicitly disagree with.
But yeah the lethality of leftist infighting is maybe a topic that deserves more delicate conversations than memes.
anarchists wrong and evil
not only is that not what we said, but db0 actually said that about us
I was there, I can form my own opinions, thanks. It was hyperbole, but that was the general level of arguments being made.
If you want left unity, it was a nonsensical way to behave. It was just more sectarianism. It does make sense as a way to behave if you just wanna argue… So thats what I assume the real intent was.
the meme being posted was “modern MLs are bloodthirsty monsters who will kill you if they ever get in power”
When you view a group as evil, that view tends to result in double standards for behavior, which is what you’re doing.
I’m probably going to dip because I’m too mad to be civil right now
Hi, if you read what I said I also did not like the meme originally posted. I’m just trying to be constructive about it instead of angey and loud.
Edit: “angey” was a typo but it makes me laugh
They posted an inflammatory meme meant to stir shit up between folks that share 99% of the same values and should be working together instead of having slapfights on the internet about shit that happened 100 years ago under entirely different material conditions, and for the record I piled on against them too as did some of our other anarchist comrades because it was reddit tier brainrot. If someone post a meme similarly lazily and unfunnily making the same joke about “anarkiddies” we would remove it and chastise the poster.
What do you want me to say? Sorry I’m not as angey as your standards demand? That all that dogpiling and toxic behavior was chill and fine because of a fucky meme? I declare hexbear.net the sovereign leader of all of leftism, I’ll say whatever you want, just chill tf out
I’m very chill, I was just pointing out why it seems like we are aggressive.
The removal of downvotes on our end mean people have to actually make the effort to tell you that you are wrong and why, and not just downvote and move on.
Trust me it is a much better system than downvotes, we have had a long time with developing policies to foster productive discussion.
When someone is so aggressively wrong or clearly posting troll bait, then of course they will perceive the pushback as aggressive as well.
the meme being posted was “modern MLs are bloodthirsty monsters who will kill you if they ever get in power”
And y’all had a chance to prove the meme wrong by not turning it into a dick measuring contest with spamming equally shitty sectarian shit that on hexbear would get you kicked out (anarchists are worthless, anarchists can’t coordinate, etc.),. And it always ends like this. Anytime i mention that in the hungarian revolution the workers councils were a way more significant factor than any western influence and they literally set up groups to hunt nazis the same agresszive smug shit arrives from people who never read anything about the topic apart from the fucking Aptheker book. I feel like the ML userbase (who are right about basically anything when it comes to capitalism) would rather off themselves that even admit that any ml leader even marginally engaged in self-serving abuse of power. Of course anarchists who aren’t familiar with the site wont be happy.
And y’all had a chance to prove the meme wrong
How many people did we shoot in the thread? Are you that easy to pander to?
admit that any ml leader even marginally engaged in self-serving abuse of power
Ask them about Khrushchev and co’s destalinization or 70s Mao or Gonzalo.
afaik hexbear unanimously hates Gonzalo, which is throwing me off trying to interpret this comment. not being snarky
All three are examples of ml leaders who took huge Ls abusing their power that nobody is afraid to criticize. I’m not familiar enough with the boiled baby guy to say whether he was actually an ml or if it was another pol pot situation.
I don’t know much about the Hungarian uprising. If the Soviet response was unjustified and draconian when they could have worked something out, that’s fucked up.
Do you have any reading recommendations?
It quite literally was tho
No it wasn’t.
Thanks for your kind words. I will admit I did get snappy towards the end of the day as I was getting tired and they had gone to straight up brigading tactics with half a dozen hexbears shitposting random replies, so there wasn’t even any point to reply anymore. It had just become a classic pile on situation because I hurt their feelings.
I’m not sure I really agree with your first point, I think finding a way to find allys in all leftists would be worth it, even if it has a dark history. Things can be better.
I’m not here to stop anyone. MLs can be allies when they act like anarchists, which they tend to do when they’re not in power. But you have to be cognizant who you’re getting in bed with.
Do you think that all ML’s harbor some innate desire to just start murdering anarchists for no particular reason when given the chance or something?
This weird self-induced paranoia can’t be good for you.
No. I think that the praxis of MLs eventually leads to ice axes in heads “for the good of the revolution”. I believe you currently never would imagine you would make such an action. I also believe that your hierarchical states will inevitably lead to it
Ah, yes. I suppose Marxism-Leninism inevitably drives people to murder, just like Islam inevitably drives people to murder.
All Marxist-Leninists are the same, just like all those swarthy Muslamics.
That seems like a perfectly reasonable view of reality you’ve got there lmao
Ice Axe.
For men.
did you just try to compare your ideology to marginalized people you nicompoop?
You’ve made it perfectly clear that you are not interested in a debate.
Which means that we can all just throw out the most ridiculous claims possible without having to defend them.
Funny how that works
My man, you’re absolutely welcome to make an ass of yourself as publicly as you want!
“First they came for the communists . . .”
Let’s not pretend racism isn’t directly connected to shitting on the dominant ideology of non white or conditionally white leftists
It took me calling the original meme racist over several hours before you edited it, and you should have noticed it in the first place. It incorrectly characterizes Mao, who was heavily influenced by anarchist thought. Integrating the good parts of anarchism into ML thought is kind of the thing he is known for, and to the extent he was successful is where a big portion of controversy around his theoretical contributions to socialism lie.
Also literally read anything about Jewish intellectual traditions and how they relate to Marxism, God damn.
I mean, you’re not proving some heads don’t need “ice-axes”.
It’s also weird to complain about Trotsky getting
when he has way more anarchist blood on his hand than MaoIt’s weird to call it an ice axe too
It’s so fascinating to see you miss point so thoroughly! It just goes to show one needs more than book smarts
Tell me again that you aren’t seeking conflict
Well you certainly lived up to to your alias today
Yeah. I’m smart as fuck dude. It’s an ice pick that Trotsky got killed with btw. An ice axe is a piece of mountain climbing equipment
So smort!
Galaxy-brain (not living up to his name) just implied that you “deserve” an ice axe in your head in a reply to your comment here, as a result of your recent posts calling them out for being violent tankies (proving you correct). Can we please defed? They’re just as bad as lemmygrad (who I came here to avoid) and last I checked you “didn’t think they were (all) tankies and would defed if they became a problem.” Can we at least admit they’re a problem now?
deleted by creator
MLs can be allies when they act like anarchists
Uh, sure, and Nazis can be allies if they act like communists. You ever wonder if the reason MLs keep shooting anarchists is because instead of trying to work together the anarchists just insist the MLs become anarchists?
You ever wonder if the reason MLs keep shooting anarchists…
gasp he said the silent part out loud!
Hey, why don’t you engage with what I said? I’m sure you feel really smug for owning me, but you forgot to actually defend anarchists.
I think finding a way to find allys in all leftists would be worth it
I am really fine working with all leftists when we go against nazis. When the goal is the same, the methods are the same or complement each other and they don’t try to take control of “my” space/group, I can work with MLs
And then there are the leftists who call anyone who disagrees with them a Nazi.
