Whatchu think wage labor is? Companies lease you for your labor, and can nullify the contract agreement (i.e. fire you) at will. If you work for a wage, you’re a wage slave.
On the other hand, let’s not minimize American prison slavery by saying “we’re all slaves”. If you strain the definition you can argue all workers under capitalism are enslaved, but even then, some forms of slavery are far more brutal and dehumanizing (and racist. Let’s not forget racist) than others.
Yeah, especially since the majority of imprisoned people tend to be non-white (this is an issue with our justice system, I’m absolutely not saying non-whites do more crime, only they’re convicted far more often due to a racist system. A great many are innocent.) this will turn into 1 to 1 a facsimile of slavery from yesteryear. Bunch of white landowners leasing cheap labor (suspiciously predominantly non-white) from people who have no other legal options. Gross.
It was this argument with my mom that helped me realize she was the sort of racist that doesn’t think she’s racist. We were talking about how black men tend to get a longer sentence for the same crimes than white men. Her stance was pretty much “well, they shouldn’t have done the crime” and I’m like… Mom. Unfair is unfair.
Thankfully we’re no longer close for other reasons.
I mean yeah I can leave whenever I want…I can “choose” my master so to speak, but unless I want to starve to death I’m forced to choose a master.
It’s literally just a nicer form of slavery. If you have a gun pointed to your head with the option “choose a master or I pull the trigger”, is that really a choice? I’d argue not.
Again, only a US-thing. Most of the world has some basic social net that covers you loosing your job. Or even quitting it (if there’s a reason other than “i don’t wanna work per se”. Here at least).
The US is one of the worst places to live unless you at least own double-digit millions. And even then you’re just a serious illness away from being broke again.
And then you’re not even allowed to kill yourself.
The least civilized nation that also shouts the loudest how they are the most awesome.
That’s like living as another slave of a dictatorship, versus living as a free person in a democracy. In context I think they’re talking about typical (dictatorship) corporations.
He is most likely talking about the typical corporations, but it doesn’t mean he’s right about pointing the finger at wages. Wage labor isn’t the cause of wage slavery and neither is the existence of a company. It’s the authoritarian company structure, which is systemic to capitalism, that is causing an unfair power dynamic between the employer and employee. That power dynamic is what creates wage slaves.
As far as wages are concerned you can get a wage and not be a wage slave. It comes down to whether the company is with an authoritarian (capitalistic) or a democratic (socialist) structure.
Whatchu think wage labor is? Companies lease you for your labor, and can nullify the contract agreement (i.e. fire you) at will. If you work for a wage, you’re a wage slave.
On the one hand, yes, I can see your point.
On the other hand, let’s not minimize American prison slavery by saying “we’re all slaves”. If you strain the definition you can argue all workers under capitalism are enslaved, but even then, some forms of slavery are far more brutal and dehumanizing (and racist. Let’s not forget racist) than others.
Yeah, especially since the majority of imprisoned people tend to be non-white (this is an issue with our justice system, I’m absolutely not saying non-whites do more crime, only they’re convicted far more often due to a racist system. A great many are innocent.) this will turn into 1 to 1 a facsimile of slavery from yesteryear. Bunch of white landowners leasing cheap labor (suspiciously predominantly non-white) from people who have no other legal options. Gross.
It was this argument with my mom that helped me realize she was the sort of racist that doesn’t think she’s racist. We were talking about how black men tend to get a longer sentence for the same crimes than white men. Her stance was pretty much “well, they shouldn’t have done the crime” and I’m like… Mom. Unfair is unfair. Thankfully we’re no longer close for other reasons.
Sorry to hear that, but good for you for making that decision.
Ah, I never meant to imply that “all slaves are equally treated just as bad”, thereby minimizing the suffering of others.
Of course some forms are far worse than others. And of course we want to help those suffering the most first and foremost.
I meant my comment as a solidarity statement. Not the straw man you crafted, apologies for the misunderstanding.
Slaves can’t end their own contract at will.
You people will never understand the difference.
I mean yeah I can leave whenever I want…I can “choose” my master so to speak, but unless I want to starve to death I’m forced to choose a master.
It’s literally just a nicer form of slavery. If you have a gun pointed to your head with the option “choose a master or I pull the trigger”, is that really a choice? I’d argue not.
Again, only a US-thing. Most of the world has some basic social net that covers you loosing your job. Or even quitting it (if there’s a reason other than “i don’t wanna work per se”. Here at least). The US is one of the worst places to live unless you at least own double-digit millions. And even then you’re just a serious illness away from being broke again. And then you’re not even allowed to kill yourself.
The least civilized nation that also shouts the loudest how they are the most awesome.
People in cooperatives are slaves? To whom exactly?
That’s like living as another slave of a dictatorship, versus living as a free person in a democracy. In context I think they’re talking about typical (dictatorship) corporations.
He is most likely talking about the typical corporations, but it doesn’t mean he’s right about pointing the finger at wages. Wage labor isn’t the cause of wage slavery and neither is the existence of a company. It’s the authoritarian company structure, which is systemic to capitalism, that is causing an unfair power dynamic between the employer and employee. That power dynamic is what creates wage slaves.
As far as wages are concerned you can get a wage and not be a wage slave. It comes down to whether the company is with an authoritarian (capitalistic) or a democratic (socialist) structure.