Counterpoint: Khan tried to take over the Enterprise and kill Kirk with basically no provocation. Kirk even found out he was a 20th century dictator and all he did was confine him to his quarters. He didn’t even put him in the brig. It sucks that Ceti Alpha IV became inhospitable to life, but the fact that he let him live freely on a planet instead of spending his life in a Federation prison was a pretty sweet deal.
Kirk’s only crime was not coming back to check on Khan or sending anyone else to check on him either, although that could totally be down to Starfleet command. Although even if SFC didn’t send anyone, you would think Kirk would want to make sure his former crewmember was doing all right.
Yeah, it definitely would have been consistent with Kirk’s character to want to check in. But honestly, if he was like, “You tried to blow up the ship and kill my entire crew. I’m giving you some supplies and then you’re on your own,” that would have been more than fair. Now, if he knew Ceti Alpha VI blew up and was like, “meh, not my problem,” that would be one thing, but it seems like everyone in the Federation was caught off guard there.
Fair enough. I can’t remember exactly how much she helped him, but I’m guessing she didn’t help him set the engines to self- destruct, so it’s not like she tried to kill anyone. You could argue that she made the choice to join them instead of facing court-martial, so it’s not on Kirk’s head, but I probably would have checked in, if for no other reason than to make sure she wasn’t being abused by the übermenschen.
if for no other reason than to make sure she wasn’t being abused by the übermenschen.
Although there’s also a question if Khan and his augments really were superior anymore. Sure, you have to apply some “triumph of humanity” mumbo-jumbo that Gene was fond of, but normal human Kirk outhinks Khan in both Space Seed and Star Trek II and Khan’s physical strength doesn’t seem to be much of an advantage in the 23rd century when humanity mixes with alien races far stronger than any augment could hope to be. Spock physically deals with Khan very easily in Space Seed and you could argue that he’s a sort of natural augment, being a mixture of human and Vulcan genes (and apparently getting all the advantages of the Vulcan genes).
Even in the 24th century, Julian and the other augments when they came to DS9 didn’t really help with anything and almost made things worse. In fact, pretty much the only augmented human that seems to have actually had some truly useful superior abilities by then was Julian.
Maybe the Eugenics Wars really failed because Khan’s genetic enhancements didn’t give he and his people the advantages it had been hoped they would have. Maybe that’s why Kirk thought his lieutenant would be okay. But I know I would have checked to make sure.
Although there’s also a question if Khan and his augments really were superior anymore…normal human Kirk outhinks Khan in both Space Seed and Star Trek II and Khan’s physical strength doesn’t seem to be much of an advantage in the 23rd century.
Very true. You could argue that it was really Spock that out-thought Khan in the end of the second movie (“He is intelligent, but not experienced. His pattern indicates 2 dimensional thinking.”). But the TOS episode definitely makes it seem like Khan was overhyped. The entire time he’s built up as his mental and physical superior, and Kirk’s brilliant gambit to defeat him is, “beat him with a pipe.”
True about Spock out-thinking him to the point of defeat in STII. I was thinking about Kirk taking over the Reliant and lowering its shields without Khan realizing he could even do that. It wasn’t the final defeat, but that should have just been an obvious contingency for Khan to plan for if he had the superior intellect he was supposed to have. He learned how to control the Enterprise in a very short amount of time, but he didn’t even check the Reliant’s computer to find out if it could be remotely accessed with a code that an admiral would probably be able to get.
It’s even made clear in dialogue in the film that Khan never thought of it.
SPOCK: Reliant’s prefix number is one six three zero nine.
SAAVIK: I don’t understand.
KIRK: You have to learn why things work on a starship.
SPOCK: Each ship has its combination code.
KIRK: To prevent an enemy do what we’re attempting. Using our console to order Reliant to lower her shields.
SPOCK: Assuming he hasn’t changed the combination. He’s quite intelligent.
So I don’t know about Spock’s assessment of his intelligence. Even in the alternate 1990s of TOS… there had already been remote-controlled space probes by 1967 when Space Seed came out.
Did Kahn ever demonstrate superhuman intelligence? He and his men apparently have the ability to learn how to fly space ships 3 centuries newer than they are, like they don’t seem to have trouble flying Reliant around, but they did have Captain Terrell and Commander Chekov as brainslugged captives.
Kahn didn’t pick up on that painfully simple “hours may seem like days” code, for example.
Counterpoint: Khan tried to take over the Enterprise and kill Kirk with basically no provocation. Kirk even found out he was a 20th century dictator and all he did was confine him to his quarters. He didn’t even put him in the brig. It sucks that Ceti Alpha IV became inhospitable to life, but the fact that he let him live freely on a planet instead of spending his life in a Federation prison was a pretty sweet deal.
Kirk’s only crime was not coming back to check on Khan or sending anyone else to check on him either, although that could totally be down to Starfleet command. Although even if SFC didn’t send anyone, you would think Kirk would want to make sure his former crewmember was doing all right.
Yeah, it definitely would have been consistent with Kirk’s character to want to check in. But honestly, if he was like, “You tried to blow up the ship and kill my entire crew. I’m giving you some supplies and then you’re on your own,” that would have been more than fair. Now, if he knew Ceti Alpha VI blew up and was like, “meh, not my problem,” that would be one thing, but it seems like everyone in the Federation was caught off guard there.
Fair apart from Lieutenant McGivers being left behind too. That is the one inconsistent part. That he didn’t check on her welfare.
Fair enough. I can’t remember exactly how much she helped him, but I’m guessing she didn’t help him set the engines to self- destruct, so it’s not like she tried to kill anyone. You could argue that she made the choice to join them instead of facing court-martial, so it’s not on Kirk’s head, but I probably would have checked in, if for no other reason than to make sure she wasn’t being abused by the übermenschen.
Although there’s also a question if Khan and his augments really were superior anymore. Sure, you have to apply some “triumph of humanity” mumbo-jumbo that Gene was fond of, but normal human Kirk outhinks Khan in both Space Seed and Star Trek II and Khan’s physical strength doesn’t seem to be much of an advantage in the 23rd century when humanity mixes with alien races far stronger than any augment could hope to be. Spock physically deals with Khan very easily in Space Seed and you could argue that he’s a sort of natural augment, being a mixture of human and Vulcan genes (and apparently getting all the advantages of the Vulcan genes).
Even in the 24th century, Julian and the other augments when they came to DS9 didn’t really help with anything and almost made things worse. In fact, pretty much the only augmented human that seems to have actually had some truly useful superior abilities by then was Julian.
Maybe the Eugenics Wars really failed because Khan’s genetic enhancements didn’t give he and his people the advantages it had been hoped they would have. Maybe that’s why Kirk thought his lieutenant would be okay. But I know I would have checked to make sure.
Very true. You could argue that it was really Spock that out-thought Khan in the end of the second movie (“He is intelligent, but not experienced. His pattern indicates 2 dimensional thinking.”). But the TOS episode definitely makes it seem like Khan was overhyped. The entire time he’s built up as his mental and physical superior, and Kirk’s brilliant gambit to defeat him is, “beat him with a pipe.”
True about Spock out-thinking him to the point of defeat in STII. I was thinking about Kirk taking over the Reliant and lowering its shields without Khan realizing he could even do that. It wasn’t the final defeat, but that should have just been an obvious contingency for Khan to plan for if he had the superior intellect he was supposed to have. He learned how to control the Enterprise in a very short amount of time, but he didn’t even check the Reliant’s computer to find out if it could be remotely accessed with a code that an admiral would probably be able to get.
It’s even made clear in dialogue in the film that Khan never thought of it.
So I don’t know about Spock’s assessment of his intelligence. Even in the alternate 1990s of TOS… there had already been remote-controlled space probes by 1967 when Space Seed came out.
Did Kahn ever demonstrate superhuman intelligence? He and his men apparently have the ability to learn how to fly space ships 3 centuries newer than they are, like they don’t seem to have trouble flying Reliant around, but they did have Captain Terrell and Commander Chekov as brainslugged captives.
Kahn didn’t pick up on that painfully simple “hours may seem like days” code, for example.
He also gave him the choice, and Kahn picked CA4.
Better to rule in hell…
Oh yeah, I completely forgot about that! Also, I was wrong, it was Ceti Alpha 5, not 4.
THIS is Ceti Alpha Five!!!
Oh yes we all read that in his voice!
I read it in Gerard Butler’s voice.
Yeah, I can’t believe I got that wrong. That’s the third most iconic line in that film.